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Bob Thomas
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« on: February 05, 2014, 12:23:14 AM »

Help a Newbie please---I have done the Y111 at FTDNA. All paper trails and genealogy show ancestors from Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Lancashire with earliest around 1650 but DNA testing shows M269-R1b1a2a1---.  I am certain I am from one of these places but can't tell which one.  Oxford has a "Tribes of Britain" test that states it will show you your tribe and give a certificate of origin.  Will this ToB Test really do this? Will it tell me where in Wales, Ireland, Scotland--or will it just say UK?  Am I spending unnecessarily for data that I already have from my FTDNA Y111 but don't know how to interpret properly because of my inexperience and lack of knowledge?  Help please.

Bob Thomas - HOBART
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« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2014, 03:43:23 PM »

Except some rare markers but a lot downstairs of M269, it is impossible to  distinguish between Wales, Lancashire, Scotland and Ireland.

To repair haplogroups see from R1b1a2-M269 in the ISOGG tree

From STR-111, some SNP predictors  could give you more precision than the basic M269.
I don't know the precision for R1b of the Athey predictor

Within L21, you have the Casey predictor
L21 is more than 60% of the people in Wales, Lancashire, Scotland and Ireland.
Try it, you will got a probability.
Robert Casey writes posts on

For the  remaining R1b, the main groups are U106, DF27, U152 , L11*, L51*, M269*

U106 is considered as the Anglo-Saxon marker (true or false ?) dominant haplogroup in East England, but not rare in your four locations

DF27 has some percents in these locations.

U152 is more frequent in East England and Scotland

L51* very rare in Isles except a presence in Navan region, North of Dublin.

For L11* frequent enough in Central England see

For M269*, not frequent in Isles , Maliclavelli a writer in this forum is a good specialist of STR haplotypes.

« Last Edit: February 11, 2014, 03:51:34 PM by palamede » Logged

Y=G2a3b1a2-L497 Wallony-Charleroi; Mt=H2a2a1 Normandy-Bray
Dodecad-DiY: E Eur 9,25% W Eur 48,48% Med 28,46% W Asia 11,70%
World9: Atl-Balt 67,61% Southern 13,23% Cauc-Gedr 12,73%
K12a: North-E 39,71% Med 37,9% Cauc 12,55% Gedr 5,78% SW Asia 2,13%
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« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2017, 10:29:53 AM »

A tribe is viewed, developmentally or historically, as a social group existing before the development of nation states, or outside them. A tribe is a group of distinct people, dependent on their land for their livelihood, who are largely self-sufficient, and not integrated into the national society. It is perhaps the term most readily understood and used by the general public to describe such communities. Stephen Corry defines tribal people as those who "have followed ways of life for many generations that are largely self-sufficient, and are clearly different from the mainstream and dominant society". This definition, however, would not apply to countries in the Middle East such as Iraq and Yemen, South Asia such as Afghanistan and many African countries such as South Sudan, where the entire population is a member of one tribe or another, and tribalism itself is dominant and mainstream.


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