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Mark Bunch
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« on: October 18, 2010, 08:44:54 AM »

The name of this thread deserves an explanation, as does its intent.  There is a branch of the Bunch family that became prominent in the area of Perth, Scotland, around 1440 or so.  The name of this thread pays homage to the Perthshire roots of the Scottish line of the family:  The North Inch is a park in the city of Perth (there's a matching South Inch), and site of a famous (or infamous) "battle royale" in 1396 between "Clan Chattan" and "Clan Kay" -- 30 men on one side fought 30 men on the other, and only 12 walked away (there were spectators to boot, including King Robert III).  Hopefully, things will remain a little calmer in our own North Inch.

The purpose of this thread is to serve as a place of discussion for all things related to Bunch genealogy and genetic genealogy, including all family names that show a match to Bunch DNA.  It's a place to ask questions, find answers, to announce your latest big genealogy discovery, or just to blow off steam.  Think of it as a virtual tavern or public house.  So pull up a virtual bar stool, choose your poison, and make yourself at home in our own North Inch.

Weapons will be checked at the door, and please refrain from carving your initials in the tables.

Thank you,

-The Proprietor
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Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2010, 11:37:51 AM »

Congratulations on the opening of the North Inch!!!  Whether or not the original progenitor of all of our various branches of the Bunch family was from Scotland, I think there is a little bit of Scotland in all of our hearts.  I think this is a wonderful place to meet and discuss all of our Bunch DNA research issues.   I think we owe particular accolades to Mark the Rustic our fearless leader in Bunch DNA research and creator and proprietor of our virtual tavern!  I would also like to welcome everyone who comes here and everyone from the currently known branches of our family, the Nelsons, the Richardsons, the Collins, the Nuckels, and the Bunches as well as from any new branches that may show up.

In the next few months, we should have results from several Family Finder Tests to discuss.  I can't wait to see if there is a provable Bunch DNA segment or two that might have come from John 1630 or any of the other patriarchs of our family.  We should also thank Jim Richardson for leading us on the Family Finder Test path and giving encouragement and vital information to those considering taking the test.  Someone has to go first.

Before we go, I think we should also thank Karen Marcum for her leadership in encouraging donations to the Bunch Project General Fund so that we will be able to do even more DNA testing.

We have a good group to start and we should make a lot of progress working as a team to discover our ancestral origins.   Here's to us!!!
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Aleda

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« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2010, 09:34:10 PM »

Here's to a truly amazing group!

I'm excited about the potential for the Family Finder test too, and look forward to the opportunity to discuss the results of project members.  I do think, though, that we're going to have to get extraordinarily lucky to identify any match-ups beyond 4th or 5th cousins.  The combination of shrinking genetic segments and exploding numbers of ancestors would seem to make figuring out (or ruling out) relationships an ever more intractable problem the further back you go.  I'm, very glad, though, that I'll have the opportunity to be proven wrong on that (and I'd be delighted if that occurs).  In any case, I hope that these results give us a better idea how to most strategically incorporate the Family Finder test into the project going ahead.

In the meantime, I have a strong candidate in mind for our first sponsored y-DNA testing, but I'm waiting to square away details before putting it out to the group.  I think our "normal" protocol will be to start with a preliminary 37-marker test, then expand to 67 markers if warranted.  In the case of our current candidate, I think a 67-marker test is warranted from the get go.

Finally, a word or two to those attempting to post to this thread.  If you're having difficulty, try logging out of World Families altogether, then going to the main World Families "Forums" and log back in.  You can get back to the Bunch forum after that by clicking on "Bunch" in the list of surname projects in the "Surname Projects Starting with Letter B" topic.  Once you do figure out how to post, please note the "Additional Options" link just below and to the left of the box where you type in your message.  Clicking on that will allow you to select "Notify me of replies" to help you keep tabs on your messages.  Holler (either generally or at me personally) if you continue to have problems.

Slainte!

-Mark
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 09:27:58 AM by Mark Bunch » Logged
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« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2010, 11:42:25 PM »

I usually don't drink during the week but you've put me in the mood for a Guinness.  This seems like a pretty user friendly place to chat.  On a business note - tangentially DNA related - I think I mentioned that I was going back to see what I actually knew about my EKBA (earliest known Bunch ancestor) James.  He married Nancy Phillips, daughter of Charles Phillips and Melvina LNU.  I checked the Phillips DNA site and there was a lineage which included my Charles.  The administrator gave my email to some of the people in that lineage and I was contacted.  According to this "cousin" Charles Phillips and his family arrived in Tennessee about 1800.  So this means that James and Nancy married - about 1818 or so in Tennessee, not in North Carolina as I had assumed.  So - I'm not sure where to go from here.  Suggestions??
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Mark Bunch
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« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2010, 09:22:42 AM »

Hi Caroline,

I don't usually have a drink before 6 am, but... Where's that barkeep!

In regard to my Tennessee ancestors, I'm in the lucky position that someone before me has already gone through the records and connected the dots.  My kin came down from Louisa County, Virginia to Grainger County, Tennessee around 1796, the year Grainger County was formed.  One of our distant cousins assembled a history of the Bunches in early Grainger County about 75 years ago, and I've benefitted from his research.  Unfortunately, not having to have done the work myself, I'm not in a good position to give you anything more than general advice.

If you're inclined to do the research on your own, I'd recommend studying the history of settlement in the area -- maybe start with online searches then invest in a reputable printed history.  Also, study historical maps.  Although your James and Nancy eventually settled in what became Anderson County, that county didn't exist until 1801, when it was formed from parts of (what were then) Knox and Grainger Counties.  The historical maps should give you an idea of which county records to check for property transactions, taxes, etc.  Here's a link to a pretty good historical map source for Tennessee (follow the link, then scroll down to the bottom of the page):

http://www.mytennesseegenealogy.com/tn-maps.html

There's a "History of the Cumberland Settlements" available through Genealogical.com that might help out as a substitute census (helpful owing to the missing federal census records up until 1830), but I'm not sure if it actually covers the area you're interested in.

You might be able to find someone who can offer more knowedgable advice through the Cumberland Gap DNA Project, administered by Roberta Estes (and co-administered by Elizabeth Bunch Smiddy).

Sorry I don't have more specific advice to offer.  Good luck!

Slainte!

-Mark
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 09:27:22 AM by Mark Bunch » Logged
Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2010, 07:32:08 PM »

Hi Caroline

I tried unsuccessfully yesterday to send you a private email to say in part that on World Vital Records I found a tombstone for James R Bunch in Maplewood Cemetery in Tennessee.  He was obviously not your James Bunch but maybe he was a cousin, nephew, son or something.  "James R Bunch, August 22, 1820- October 17, 1873"  I am going to see if this posts and then I am going to try again to send you a private email with the same info from the North Inch.  "If at first you don't succeed, try again." 
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Aleda

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« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2010, 12:27:56 AM »

Hi Mark

How does the clock in this tavern work?  I notice the time on the entries I have written is about 6 hours earlier than my clock which is on Eastern Daylight Time.  Is our clock in the North Inch on Hawaiian time?  I am perfectly happy with Hawaii.  I just think it is an odd choice for Scotland.

Aleda
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Aleda

Karen Marcum
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« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2010, 10:17:27 AM »

I don't know how I got here as I kept trying yesterday...but today I went right to our new chat room.  So hello all kinfolk.  Still waiting for my uncle's packet for the Family Finder to arrive. 
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Karen Marcum
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« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2010, 03:23:00 PM »

I rec'd a link on a new book writtten by a Nuckells and posted on the Nuckells group site that Larry Nuckels hooked me up with.  After talking with Minnie today, she had gone into the link and read some of the book which is titled "The Rose... more lines to the title.  She said the book was really good and that you could read a good bit on it online through the Google site it is on.  I will try to read if this evening after I return from church.  Minnie loved it, so I checked to see the price.  It is just about $26 or so.  Not bad at all.  I think I sent you all the e-mail yesterday with the link to read the preview, but if not just let me know so I can.

Karen

I didn't even know you could go online and preview a new book.  Changes every day...I guess you can teach an old dog new tricks.  Ain't technology grand?  Just had to put that "ain't" in there.
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Mark Bunch
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« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2010, 09:00:55 PM »

Hi Aleda,

I'm not sure about how bar time works in here, but my off-the-cuff guess is that it was originally set up for Wales time -- Wales, Alaska, that is.  :-)  Honestly, the server may be in Hawaii, or maybe the powers-that-be decided to just put the whole World Families Forum on the westernmost US time zone.  Good question!

Hi Karen,

Glad to see you found your way in here.  Thanks for the tip on the Nucholls book.  I'm not sure if I have the link, but chances are good that I'll be able to track it down.  If not, I'll holler at you for the link.  The old Nucholls website had a browsable family tree -- I didn't look to see if that made it over to the new site.  If not, I'll miss it.

Follow-up: I found the book on Google Books.  The title is, "The Roses: The Nuckolls Family, the Lyman Family, and One Hundred Fifty Immigrants Who Helped Shape America," by Charles R. Nuckolls (there are about 50 different ways to spell "Nuckolls," so I may not be off on the spelling of Charles' last name).

Slainte!

-Mark
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 09:17:42 PM by Mark Bunch » Logged
Min
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« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2010, 07:19:39 PM »

Hello

They finally let me in The North Inch, you know those jumbled up letters and numbers in the little box you have to retype !

Been under the weather spending as much time as I felt like reading, always searching for the Bunch, Nuckols, Knuckle and Richardson's surname trying to
find anything that leads to George W. Nelson.  Sorry I don't have anything to add concerning those surnames but I do have every intention to keep trying.

Min
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« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2010, 08:09:00 PM »

I read till way in the night last night on the book - THE ROSE (about the Nuckolls).  Mark was kind enough to type the entire title.  I couldn't remember it long enough to type it in.  I refreshed myself with American history in reading the book online.  Had forgotten a lot of stuff about the history of our country and read stuff I had never known.  It is good that it is readable online for a while. 

They are having a sale on FTDNA tests.  Might be a good time for Mark to choose someone to test.  I noticed that the Family Finder and Y12 test is now $299.  Not sure, but Y12 is not very far up the chain of testing is it?  I could be wrong as I don't know much about the DNA tests.  Anymore testing you can get for free though seems it might be a help.

Kim is looking for this site.  Hope she finds it soon.
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Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2010, 08:27:29 PM »

Hi Min

Welcome to the North Inch!!!

I hope you are feeling better soon.  There are so many bugs going around.

Karen

Thank you for sending the link to the book on the Nuckolls, "The Rose", yesterday.   I followed the link to preview the book and stayed up way too late because the book was to intertesting to stop reading.  I didn't finish, because I knew I had to get up early today.  I may buy the book eventually it was so interesting.

Hi Mark,

We may never know what time the powers that be are using on our tavern clock, but at least they are using a time.  One blog that I like to read from time to time doesn't put the time on the comments so you never know when any comments were made.  Even if the clock here isn't the best, the North Inch is a great place to visit.  You did a good job setting it up!!!

Aleda
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Kim Sheppard
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« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2010, 02:02:19 PM »

Hi Everyone,

I finally figured out how to get here.  I don't have anything to add yet, but I really like this site.

Kim
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Kim

Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2010, 09:06:48 PM »

Hi Everyone,

Where is everyone?  No one seems to have posted here in the past few days!!!   Karen has made a lot of progress in recruiting descendants for DNA testing and we should be getting some results to compare in late November to mid December.  We need to keep our esprit de corps!  We should have the answers to some of our questions soon. 

Aleda
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Aleda

Min
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« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2010, 10:58:06 PM »

Hi Aleda

I am still here and do so enjoy your email. Yes Karen has been busy with her search for another Nelson male for testing, I have not had such luck, any approach I take has been disappointing. I have also been cautious about who I ask, afraid we will be climbing someone elses family tree.

I found a Robert Bunch , felon, transported from London in 1742, does he belong to someone in our group ? Still trying to sort them out.

Min



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Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2010, 11:55:42 PM »

Hi Min,

I don't know Robert Bunch but it would be interesting if he had a male line descendant who would get DNA testing.

Henry Bunch was born around 1690 and DNA wise appears to have been related to John Bunch who was born around 1630.  I suspect that they were not closely related to Robert.

It would be good if we could trace Robert further.

I am really glad someone else is here at the North Inch.

Aleda
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Aleda

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« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2010, 12:25:45 PM »

Hi Min,

Were you able to find any more information about Robert Bunch, the transported felon (I seem to remember reading somewhere that in the old records, when someone was said to have been transported, it generally meant they were a prisoner)?  It would be interesting to try tracking his descendants and cousins.  Does your information specify where he was transported from and where to?

Slainte!

-Mark
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Min
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« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2010, 09:23:17 PM »

Mark

I will go back to the book I was reading, it is online. I have been reading anything and everything about White Indentured Servants and the transporting of thousands of people to the "Tobacco Islands" and the Colonies.

Sometimes it is just names on a list other times there are follow up's, it could be he was just a name. Yes from what I understand exiled or transported did not necessary mean they were placed on a ship. I have been looking at the names that were sent to the colonies then trying to find if there are old records of them later, have found a few that are very interesting. Also finding the laws passed that dictated the white servants every day life, some were transported against their will others came voluntarily as indentures for 7 years. The permission to marry law applied to the white servants also. In 1705 Virginia passed a law that prohibited the whipping of Christian white servants naked without the consent of a Justice, or secret burials of servants. Those laws I found among others in 'The Century Volume -1884 Making of America Project ".

That is why the inquiry about a Robert Bunch to see if someone could claim or tell me about him before I spend days looking.


Min
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« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2010, 11:00:39 PM »

Mark

I found Robert Bunch, felon, transported on the ship Bladen from London to Maryland, June 1742.  Book: Bonded Passangers to America, Pete Wilson Coldham. I have not found anything else about him or anyone working on
his line, I did see a reference to Robert Bunch "Settled " in Maryland  1742.

I found a William Bunch on one list also transported from London 1742, he was not in the book by Coldham, there was a William Bunch escaped from his master in Maryland, nothing as to what happened to him.

Both of those fellows could have been under the age of 20, so many in that time frame were children , some down to 8-10 years old, looking at a list of childrens names on a ship, 5 out of 10 died during the passage.

If they managed to escape and were not captured they sometimes changed their names, stands to reason they would do that.

Min
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Aleda Bunch
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« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2010, 11:17:37 PM »

Hi Min

Thanks for the interesting information.  I hope we will know one day what happened to Robert Bunch and to William Bunch and if they left any descendants who could join our group.

Goor job!

Aleda
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Aleda

Mark Bunch
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« Reply #21 on: November 04, 2010, 11:09:43 PM »

Hi All,

Min, I looked around a little for Robert Bunch in census records, but didn't find anything suggestive.  He probably passed away before the 1790 census, and if he had any descendants, they may have moved out of Maryland.  I did find London "Old Bailey" court records mentioning his sentence to be transported.  I'll be keeping an eye peeled for him.  He might show up in the online Maryland archives.  Hmmm...

-Mark
« Last Edit: November 04, 2010, 11:10:34 PM by Mark Bunch » Logged
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