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Author Topic: Relative Proportions of R1b1b2 Groups in Ysearch  (Read 3336 times)
Jafety R1b-U152
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« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2009, 04:22:34 AM »

What I am finding, too, is that R1b1b2 haplotypes of different subclades are remarkably, frustratingly close. I go through YSearch all the time running the haplotypes of various members of the R-L21 Plus Project and then trying to recruit their haplotype neighbors for Deep Clade-R testing and, if they turn out to be L21+, for project membership.

I used to think a 33/37 "match" was a fairly good one. Not anymore. There are men of different subclades that are that close at 37 markers! Just today I sent a recruitment email to one in particular, a 33/37 "match" to one of our members. That person answered me saying the test had already been done and came up U106+ L48+! That's not even P312+, let alone L21+! (Now you see why I am putting quotation marks around the word match.)

I can only conclude that R1b1b2 (or maybe R1b1b2a1) must have expanded very rapidly, fairly recently. What else can account for all the similarity in haplotypes between different subclades of R1b1b2?

I think the same now. And it is in line with the R1a1 distribution where the same haplotypes appear in Norway and India...

I suppose the "intra-clade" diversification of R1b1b2 and R1a1 already happened in the "homeland", before the quick spread of these haplogroups.

I looked up for some studies and R1a1 diversity is 0.55 in Bosnia while only 0.38 in India-Pakistan-Iran which supports the Klyosov hypotheses on the "out of Balkans orgin". P312 and U106 are also very frequent in the neighbouring regions of the Balkans, namely the Danube valley and N Italy so I would not be surprised if some P312 and U106 would appear on the Balkans later as research goes on.
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Y-DNA: R1b1b2a1b4 (S28/U-152) L2 test pending
Earliest known paternal ancestor: Matthias Fejer, b. 1819, Jaszarokszallas, Jasz county, Central Hungary
MtDNA: U4 (Western Siberian Ugric)
rms2
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« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2009, 12:51:11 PM »

I think the same now. And it is in line with the R1a1 distribution where the same haplotypes appear in Norway and India...

I suppose the "intra-clade" diversification of R1b1b2 and R1a1 already happened in the "homeland", before the quick spread of these haplogroups.

I looked up for some studies and R1a1 diversity is 0.55 in Bosnia while only 0.38 in India-Pakistan-Iran which supports the Klyosov hypotheses on the "out of Balkans orgin". P312 and U106 are also very frequent in the neighbouring regions of the Balkans, namely the Danube valley and N Italy so I would not be surprised if some P312 and U106 would appear on the Balkans later as research goes on.


Yeah, I think R1b1b2 may have entered SE Europe from Anatolia during the Neolithic Period and moved on, proliferating rapidly during the Neolithic and subsequently in the Bronze Age, with U106 and its subclades and P312 and its subclades appearing in pretty rapid succession.
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rms2
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« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2009, 08:10:48 PM »

We must be between lab batches or something. I look for new "R1b1b2a1b5" entries every day, but lately things have been pretty dry.

And my recruiting efforts have largely been ignored. I usually get some sort of response, but lately I've been getting zip.
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Jafety R1b-U152
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« Reply #28 on: May 11, 2009, 03:13:41 AM »

What I can not understand: why are people taking tests and spending money if after the result they do not join projects/are not interested any more...
Weird...
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Y-DNA: R1b1b2a1b4 (S28/U-152) L2 test pending
Earliest known paternal ancestor: Matthias Fejer, b. 1819, Jaszarokszallas, Jasz county, Central Hungary
MtDNA: U4 (Western Siberian Ugric)
Mike Walsh
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« Reply #29 on: May 11, 2009, 10:35:24 AM »

...
And my recruiting efforts have largely been ignored. I usually get some sort of response, but lately I've been getting zip.
rms2, we definitely appreciate your efforts so please keep up the recruiting.   For those who understand hitting the baseball, I'm beginning to think this is much like that.  "Success" should not be defined as getting a large proportion of DNA test participants to do upgrades and join projects.  Victory is just chipping away a few here and there.

We all need to recruit amongst genealogical as well as genetic surname and geographical projects and blogs.  The more "at bats" we all take collectively, the faster things will happen.
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R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
susanrosine
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« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2009, 05:25:45 PM »

And my recruiting efforts have largely been ignored. I usually get some sort of response, but lately I've been getting zip.
Just curious--recruiting efforts for exactly WHAT? For deep clade testing? For men to post their results to Y-search? Other??
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Dad: JAMES:  Ysearch QSCQ3;  R-P312, L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5*)
Dad: mitosearch QSCQ3; T1a; no matches HVR2 or FGS
Mom's brother: LEWTER: Ysearch FYFDA;  R-U106, L48+ (R1b1b2a1a*)
Mom's brother: mitosearch FYFDA, U5b2; 1 exac
Mike Walsh
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« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2009, 11:17:56 PM »

And my recruiting efforts have largely been ignored. I usually get some sort of response, but lately I've been getting zip.
Just curious--recruiting efforts for exactly WHAT? For deep clade testing? For men to post their results to Y-search? Other??
RMS2 has spent a lot of time trying to get L21+ folks to join the L21 project and I think he also encourages deep clade R and 67 marker upgrades to "suspects" that probably fit into the P312 world.
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R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
rms2
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« Reply #32 on: May 21, 2009, 07:43:10 AM »

That's right. I spend a lot of time sifting through YSearch trying to find men who might be L21+. I send them an email asking them to order the Deep Clade-R test and to join the project if they are L21+.

It's not easy to find an L21+ by haplotype, I can tell you. I recruited one of my own close "matches" for testing. He and I matched 27/28, but he turned out to be U106+ L48+! That blew me away, because I thought he was L21+ for sure. Now I figure if he had 67 markers we would probably not be such a close "match".

Probably for every 20 emails I send, I get one answer back, and sometimes that answer is a polite (or not so polite) "Not interested".
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susanrosine
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« Reply #33 on: May 21, 2009, 01:58:54 PM »

I will do my part to help you. I am the admin/co-admin for several FTDNA projects. I'll put the word out for men to add their results to Y-search. I always encourage deep clade testing, and have been having much success in getting more men to test since I came onboard the Wales DNA project a few months ago.  I'll also advise my known L21+ men to join the L21 project.
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Dad: JAMES:  Ysearch QSCQ3;  R-P312, L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5*)
Dad: mitosearch QSCQ3; T1a; no matches HVR2 or FGS
Mom's brother: LEWTER: Ysearch FYFDA;  R-U106, L48+ (R1b1b2a1a*)
Mom's brother: mitosearch FYFDA, U5b2; 1 exac
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