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Author Topic: R-L21* is Now R1b1b2a1b5 at FTDNA  (Read 6020 times)
rms2
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« on: March 15, 2009, 01:22:10 PM »

Just this morning R-L21* is now listed by Family Tree DNA on its web pages, including its projects and personal "myFTDNA" pages, as "R1b1b2a1b5."

I guess we finally made it onto the YCC Tree, and it's probably no coincidence that the genetic genealogy conference has been going on in Houston the last few days.

This is cool, but I wonder if it is taking into account L51, which is the newly discovered SNP upstream of L11/P310/P311, which are all upstream of P312.
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Jdean
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« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2009, 03:11:15 PM »

Just this morning R-L21* is now listed by Family Tree DNA on its web pages, including its projects and personal "myFTDNA" pages, as "R1b1b2a1b5."

I guess we finally made it onto the YCC Tree, and it's probably no coincidence that the genetic genealogy conference has been going on in Houston the last few days.

This is cool, but I wonder if it is taking into account L51, which is the newly discovered SNP upstream of L11/P310/P311, which are all upstream of P312.

And consequently you can now search for it at Y-search, there are three with ancestral origins saying Spain, and one from Puerto Rico with a Spanish name
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rms2
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« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2009, 03:12:19 PM »

FTDNA's IT folks have updated YSearch, as well. Men who have tested R-L21* have been automatically updated to R1b1b2a1b5. As a result, it is now possible to do a "Search by Haplogroup" to find those who are currently known to be R-L21*.

I've already found a couple of new R-L21* Germans, a German-Swiss, and a Spaniard I didn't know about.
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rms2
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« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2009, 03:17:37 PM »

And consequently you can now search for it at Y-search, there are three with ancestral origins saying Spain, and one from Puerto Rico with a Spanish name

Thus far, only Arrizabalaga can confirm an actual paper trail to Spain. I have not heard from one of the possible Spanish subjects yet (I have emailed him this afternoon), so he could actually be Spanish. One of the others is another matter. All I can say about that is I cannot confidently place it in Spain at all. In fact, I'm pretty confident in the other direction.

We have a couple of Puerto Ricans in the R-L21 Plus Project. One of them has a most distant y ancestor with the very un-Hispanic surname of Raford, and the other has a family tradition (which he told me about himself) of an English y ancestor on the island of Martinique.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2009, 03:18:10 PM by rms2 » Logged

rms2
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« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2009, 07:38:47 AM »

I emailed FTDNA a few days ago about a couple of guys who I know are R-L21* but who did not get the magic "R1b1b2a1b5" in YSearch. I was told FTDNA is working on that but that they plan to go to the shorthand system very soon because of the cumbersome length of haplogroup designators.

Sounds good to me. Very soon we will all probably go from "R1b1b2a1b5" to "R-L21" or maybe "R-L21*."
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Munoz
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« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2010, 02:50:20 PM »

I am 8 weeks in to the subclad test. The results so far are R1b1b2a1b5*, With Surname Munoz , I have a paper trail on the paternal side to early 1600s down in to Mexico, and am slowly working to find link from 1600 to 1500s which I believe will bridge the gap to Spain. I did the 67 marker paternal test. I have a lot of work to do still to figure out clues through various websites and surname projects. Will be happy to share all results.
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rms2
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« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2010, 07:22:10 PM »

I am 8 weeks in to the subclad test. The results so far are R1b1b2a1b5*, With Surname Munoz , I have a paper trail on the paternal side to early 1600s down in to Mexico, and am slowly working to find link from 1600 to 1500s which I believe will bridge the gap to Spain. I did the 67 marker paternal test. I have a lot of work to do still to figure out clues through various websites and surname projects. Will be happy to share all results.

Please join the R-L21 Plus Project.

We would be very glad to have you as a member.

If you are an FTDNA customer, just go to your "myFTDNA" pages and click on "Join Projects" on the left side of the screen. Then scroll down to Y Haplogroup Projects and click on "R28". Next, scroll down until you find R-L21Plus. Click on it and then on the little orange "Join" button in the lower right.

Thanks!
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rms2
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« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2010, 09:08:56 PM »

Thanks for joining, Munoz!
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Muaythaikid
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« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2011, 04:05:35 AM »

Hey there I just discovered these post here I know they are a bit old but I was wondering if you all could help me out because it seems to fit my issue. I just received my Haplogroups from 23andme.com and for my paternal haplogroup I am R1b1b2a1a2f* 23andme put an astrid at the end of the f. And it is  essentially a placeholder for a question mark. 23andme plan to specify those branches more specifically but need more information. Anyways I was reading on another forum that R1b1b2a1a2f* is actually in theory equivalent to "R-L21" and that Family Tree DNA calls this haplogroup R1b1b2a1b5. which is what is being discussed here and I noticed you were all talking about Spain which is the connection I am looking for! Most people I have talked to have been of Irish descent with L21 but in my case on my paternal side the farthest back I can go is my great-grandfather who was born in Antioquia, Colombia we have a spanish Surname Cardenas and to my knowledge descended from people from the Iberian peninsula, there was even talk in my family that he was basque but I really don't know. Anybody have more information for me? I could really use some help thanks!
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 04:06:52 AM by Muaythaikid » Logged
NealtheRed
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« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2011, 09:22:31 AM »

Hey there I just discovered these post here I know they are a bit old but I was wondering if you all could help me out because it seems to fit my issue. I just received my Haplogroups from 23andme.com and for my paternal haplogroup I am R1b1b2a1a2f* 23andme put an astrid at the end of the f. And it is  essentially a placeholder for a question mark. 23andme plan to specify those branches more specifically but need more information. Anyways I was reading on another forum that R1b1b2a1a2f* is actually in theory equivalent to "R-L21" and that Family Tree DNA calls this haplogroup R1b1b2a1b5. which is what is being discussed here and I noticed you were all talking about Spain which is the connection I am looking for! Most people I have talked to have been of Irish descent with L21 but in my case on my paternal side the farthest back I can go is my great-grandfather who was born in Antioquia, Colombia we have a spanish Surname Cardenas and to my knowledge descended from people from the Iberian peninsula, there was even talk in my family that he was basque but I really don't know. Anybody have more information for me? I could really use some help thanks!

One of my good friends is from Medellin, so welcome to the forum! Yes, L21 is frequent in Spain, especially the northern areas - the Basque Country, in particular. I am not knowledgeable about Basque surnames though, but I am sure that is a possibility.

Depending on the company, different nomenclature is used for R-L21. That is why you see the difference in reporting between FTDNA and 23andMe.

I hope this helps somewhat!
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« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2011, 10:10:32 AM »

Hey there I just discovered these post here I know they are a bit old but I was wondering if you all could help me out because it seems to fit my issue. I just received my Haplogroups from 23andme.com and for my paternal haplogroup I am R1b1b2a1a2f* 23andme put an astrid at the end of the f. And it is  essentially a placeholder for a question mark. 23andme plan to specify those branches more specifically but need more information. Anyways I was reading on another forum that R1b1b2a1a2f* is actually in theory equivalent to "R-L21" and that Family Tree DNA calls this haplogroup R1b1b2a1b5. which is what is being discussed here and I noticed you were all talking about Spain which is the connection I am looking for! Most people I have talked to have been of Irish descent with L21 but in my case on my paternal side the farthest back I can go is my great-grandfather who was born in Antioquia, Colombia we have a spanish Surname Cardenas and to my knowledge descended from people from the Iberian peninsula, there was even talk in my family that he was basque but I really don't know. Anybody have more information for me? I could really use some help thanks!
Do you have a Ysearch record?  If not please create one.
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R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
Muaythaikid
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« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2011, 01:00:32 PM »

Ah ok cool Thanks! I figured he was from northern spain its what it seems like. Unfortunately no photos survives of my great-grandfather but from physical descriptions they said he was tall,   blondhair and blue eyed. It seems there are a lot of people from Medellin and surrounding area with Basque heritage. I found the Y-search but I am confused about creating a new user there is a part where I have to input Genetic markers. I am a 23andme customer. What is the process or conversion to do so?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 01:50:31 PM by Muaythaikid » Logged
rms2
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« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2011, 07:03:40 PM »

Now R-L21 is no longer R1b1b2a1b5. Since the most recent YCC update it is R1b1a2a1a1b4.

And that's likely to change many more times in the coming years, so the shorthand, "R-L21", is probably best.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 07:04:12 PM by rms2 » Logged

Muaythaikid
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« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2011, 07:09:26 PM »

Well it was just speculation but from what I got from 23andme I am R1b1b2a1a2f*
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rms2
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« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2011, 07:13:03 PM »

Well it was just speculation but from what I got from 23andme I am R1b1b2a1a2f*

Yeah, that's their version of R-L21.

Are you also a Family Tree DNA customer? If so, you can join the R-L21 Plus Project:

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/R-L21/default.aspx?section=yresults
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 07:13:18 PM by rms2 » Logged

Muaythaikid
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« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2011, 07:34:02 PM »

No I am not a Family Tree DNA member but I'm thinking I should become one and do their test. Is R-L21 found in Spain, specifically within the Basque population?
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rms2
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« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2011, 07:38:49 PM »

No I am not a Family Tree DNA member but I'm thinking I should become one and do their test. Is R-L21 found in Spain, specifically within the Basque population?

Yes, it seems to be fairly common in Spain, especially in Northern Spain, including the Basque country.

In fact, I just found a new R-L21 in Galicia a couple of minutes ago (I know Galicia is not in the Basque country, but it shows that new R-L21 are turning up in Spain on a regular basis).
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 07:39:07 PM by rms2 » Logged

Muaythaikid
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« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2011, 07:45:31 PM »

Well this would make sense in my case! Having a spanish surname and my Great-grandfather was from South America. Awesome! I wish there was some way to pin point it better!
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rms2
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« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2011, 08:08:03 PM »

Well this would make sense in my case! Having a spanish surname and my Great-grandfather was from South America. Awesome! I wish there was some way to pin point it better!

Please order a kit from Family Tree DNA (even a 12-marker y-dna test would be better than nothing) and join the R-L21 Plus Project.

We would be overjoyed to have you with us.
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Muaythaikid
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« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2011, 08:21:23 PM »

Thank you! Yes I will definitely order a kit! Where can I participate in this project? Is it on the website for the R-21 Plus project? What's the name of the one you recommend which is the best test?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 08:22:27 PM by Muaythaikid » Logged
rms2
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« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2011, 08:27:06 PM »

Thank you! Yes I will definitely order a kit! Where can I participate in this project? Is it on the website for the R-21 Plus project? What's the name of the one you recommend which is the best test?

I think the best bet for a first order is the 67-marker y-dna test.

I believe if you click "Join Request" at the top of the project web site, you should be able to order a kit.

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/R-L21/default.aspx?section=yresults

Of course, you can also go to FTDNA's web site and order:

http://www.familytreedna.com/

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Muaythaikid
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« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2011, 08:29:32 PM »

ok excellent! Thank you!
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OConnor
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« Reply #22 on: June 14, 2011, 09:03:27 PM »

Well this would make sense in my case! Having a spanish surname and my Great-grandfather was from South America. Awesome! I wish there was some way to pin point it better!

Perhaps join a Project for Spain too.
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Casa-de-Espana_HouseofSpain-DNA/default.aspx

I have Joined 5 projects after getting my FTDNA homepage.
Geographical, Surname, and SNP projects.

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R1b1a2a1a1b4


R-DF13**(L21>DF13)
M42+, M45+, M526+, M74+, M89+, M9+, M94+, P108+, P128+, P131+, P132+, P133+, P134+, P135+, P136+, P138+, P139+, P14+, P140+, P141+, P143+, P145+, P146+, P148+, P149+, P151+, P157+, P158+, P159+, P160+, P161+, P163+, P166+, P187+, P207+, P224+, P226+, P228+, P229+, P230+, P231+, P232+, P233+, P234+, P235+, P236+, P237+, P238+, P239+, P242+, P243+, P244+, P245+, P280+, P281+, P282+, P283+, P284+, P285+, P286+, P294+, P295+, P297+, P305+, P310+, P311+, P312+, P316+, M173+, M269+, M343+, P312+, L21+, DF13+, M207+, P25+, L11+, L138+, L141+, L15+, L150+, L16+, L23+, L51+, L52+, M168+, M173+, M207+, M213+, M269+, M294+, M299+, M306+, M343+, P69+, P9.1+, P97+, PK1+, SRY10831.1+, L21+, L226-, M37-, M222-, L96-, L193-, L144-, P66-, SRY2627-, M222-, DF49-, L371-, DF41-, L513-, L555-, L1335-, L1406-, Z251-, L526-, L130-, L144-, L159.2-, L192.1-, L193-, L195-, L96-, DF21-, Z255-, DF23-, DF1-, Z253-, M37-, M65-, M73-, M18-, M126-, M153-, M160-, P66-

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Muaythaikid
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« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2011, 11:50:40 PM »

Cool I'll check it out! Thanks :D
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