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IALEM
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« Reply #325 on: October 27, 2010, 05:14:10 PM »

Found a brand new Spanish R-L21 in Ysearch: Carrasco, Ysearch 7WB3C.

The entry just lists Spain for a location and nothing more detailed. I am trying to recruit him for the R-L21 Plus Project.
That is a very common surname. There is at least 4 diferent Carrasco origins.

1) From the mountains of northern Burgos, close to the Basque Country

2) From the mountains of the Iberian System, in the east, close to the Mediterranean coast

3) A surname adopted by Jewish converse

4) The name of royal messengers in Castile in medieval times.

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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

jerome72
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« Reply #326 on: October 29, 2010, 11:50:36 AM »

Found a brand new Spanish R-L21 in Ysearch: Carrasco, Ysearch 7WB3C.

The entry just lists Spain for a location and nothing more detailed. I am trying to recruit him for the R-L21 Plus Project.

Well! I think that, at first, we underestimated the importance of haplogroup L21 in Spain. Me anyway!
This gives the impression that L21 is in a large north-west Spain, at least as predominant as on the western coasts of France and even England.

Who have hypothesis?

An unique people along the coasts or the final outcome of a race from the east and L21 which would be the first to have reached the shores of the ocean?
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rms2
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« Reply #327 on: November 27, 2010, 03:47:42 PM »

A new Spanish R-L21 joined the R-L21 Plus Project today: ancestral surname Sanchez, from Andalusia, kit 171804, Ysearch XVJS5.

Sanchez from Andalusia is all I know right now. I am trying to get further information.
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rms2
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« Reply #328 on: November 27, 2010, 07:26:25 PM »

A new Spanish R-L21 joined the R-L21 Plus Project today: ancestral surname Sanchez, from Andalusia, kit 171804, Ysearch XVJS5.

Sanchez from Andalusia is all I know right now. I am trying to get further information.

Got that info: Francisco SÁNCHEZ, Córdoba 1798.
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Mike Walsh
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« Reply #329 on: November 29, 2010, 12:49:59 PM »

A new Spanish R-L21 joined the R-L21 Plus Project today: ancestral surname Sanchez, from Andalusia, kit 171804, Ysearch XVJS5.
Sanchez from Andalusia is all I know right now. I am trying to get further information.
Got that info: Francisco SÁNCHEZ, Córdoba 1798.
Am I seeing this correctly? If you look at his haplotype with normal step-wise STR mutations, Sánchez is way off the R-L21 charts. His GD's are 32 to 47 over 67 with the rest of R-L21*.  The implication could be that R-L21 is older than we think and this provides more credence for a N.Africa route to Iberia and a tie to Bell Beakers out of Portugal.

The driver for the high GD's for Sánchez is 413=14,14 where as L21 modal is 23,23 (so you have a GD of 18 just at 413), .

The explanation may be very simply a recLOH event so we should subtract 17 from those very high GD's.  I see DYS413 is on a palinrome region called P8.
http://www.dna-fingerprint.com/static/PalindromicRegion-V2.pdf

If we count Sánchez' 413=14,14 as a GD of 1 from 413=23,23 then his GD's from everyone else drop to the range of 15 to 30 over 67.  That still puts him on the edge of L21's GD ranges but at least doesn't change the age of L21

Is there any way to verify this is a recLOH?

« Last Edit: November 29, 2010, 12:50:33 PM by Mikewww » Logged

R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
Jdean
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« Reply #330 on: November 29, 2010, 04:49:02 PM »


The driver for the high GD's for Sánchez is 413=14,14 where as L21 modal is 23,23 (so you have a GD of 18 just at 413), .

The explanation may be very simply a recLOH event so we should subtract 17 from those very high GD's.  I see DYS413 is on a palinrome region called P8.
http://www.dna-fingerprint.com/static/PalindromicRegion-V2.pdf


Is there any way to verify this is a recLOH?



There are two L144 people in the whalen project with 16-16

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/whalen/default.aspx?section=yresults

The rest of the group is 16-23, so that does suggest a recLOH in those cases

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Y-DNA R-DF49*
MtDNA J1c2e
Kit No. 117897
Ysearch 3BMC9

rms2
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« Reply #331 on: April 02, 2011, 01:15:52 PM »

We have a new Basque R-L21 in the R-L21 Plus Project: Amuchastegui, kit N93033, whose ancestor came from Markina-Xemein, Spain.

No Ysearch entry yet.

He's in that Spanish cluster with 385=12-14 and 459=10-10.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2011, 01:16:17 PM by rms2 » Logged

rms2
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« Reply #332 on: April 02, 2011, 09:24:33 PM »

We have a new Basque R-L21 in the R-L21 Plus Project: Amuchastegui, kit N93033, whose ancestor came from Markina-Xemein, Spain.

No Ysearch entry yet.

He's in that Spanish cluster with 385=12-14 and 459=10-10.

He's got a Ysearch entry now: 5ZZXA.
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IALEM
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« Reply #333 on: April 04, 2011, 05:09:39 PM »

Markina is less than 10 miles from my home town
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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

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« Reply #334 on: April 04, 2011, 08:00:28 PM »

Markina is less than 10 miles from my home town

Cool.

I wonder if we could recruit some more Basques for L21 testing.
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rms2
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« Reply #335 on: April 20, 2011, 09:45:19 AM »

We have another new Spanish R-L21 this morning: Guillén, kit N94538. He is a Spanish citizen.

Unfortunately, thus far, Guillén has no Ysearch entry, only 12 markers, and did not list the birthplace of his most distant y-dna ancestor, although he did identify the country as Spain.

Anyway, I am very happy to get another new Spanish member.
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IALEM
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« Reply #336 on: April 21, 2011, 06:07:13 AM »

Guillen is a patronymic, so it hasn´t got a definite territorial origin
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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

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« Reply #337 on: April 21, 2011, 01:08:07 PM »

I guess it's okay to say this gentleman is from Zaragoza, but he hasn't yet indicated where his ancestor came from.
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rms2
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« Reply #338 on: April 21, 2011, 09:40:14 PM »

You know, I forgot about the complexity of Spanish surnames and thus neglected to report that Guillén's surname is more accurately Berdejo Guillén.

Doesn't that mean the y-dna line is really Berdejo?
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IALEM
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« Reply #339 on: April 25, 2011, 03:42:53 PM »

That is correct, the Y-DNA line should be Berdejo.
The surname comes from a small town called Berdejo, in the province of Zaragoza. The name itself comes from the green colour (Berde/Verde=Green) of the local stone.
The town itself is very small, presently c.60 people living there. However between 12th and 14th century the castle of Berdejo was of some strategic importance, protecting the border of the kingdom of Aragon againts the kingdom of Castille, and it was probably then that the surname was born.
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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

Paco Berdejo
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« Reply #340 on: May 04, 2011, 05:20:15 AM »

That is correct, the Y-DNA line should be Berdejo.
The surname comes from a small town called Berdejo, in the province of Zaragoza. The name itself comes from the green colour (Berde/Verde=Green) of the local stone.
The town itself is very small, presently c.60 people living there. However between 12th and 14th century the castle of Berdejo was of some strategic importance, protecting the border of the kingdom of Aragon againts the kingdom of Castille, and it was probably then that the surname was born.
Hello friends,I am Francisco Berdejo,as I have mentioned I reply,actually I R-L21+ butstill my test is in progress,I think will be M37,I´m Aragones and Spanish probably from a few millennia ago,my ancestors I can tell you always have been in Spain so it is there where you ought to place them,you can check on this if you wish but this research still I have to do it thoroughly,now I want to ask something I need to know more about my origins and you can help me, I appreciate that I tell us what you please,sorry for my bad English,greetings to all.....
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Paco Berdejo
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« Reply #341 on: May 04, 2011, 05:34:54 AM »

Hola otra vez,me gustaría poder mantener contacto informativo con Españoles que sean R-L21,Para intercambiar opiniones e investigar nuestro común origen,si alguien esta interesado le agradecería que me lo hiciera saber para ponernos en contacto de alguna manera,un saludo.
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IALEM
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« Reply #342 on: May 05, 2011, 08:56:06 AM »

Hola otra vez,me gustaría poder mantener contacto informativo con Españoles que sean R-L21,Para intercambiar opiniones e investigar nuestro común origen,si alguien esta interesado le agradecería que me lo hiciera saber para ponernos en contacto de alguna manera,un saludo.
Hola Paco
Mi email es aryaman13atHotmail.com si quieres establecer contacto
Saludos
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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

Paco Berdejo
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« Reply #343 on: May 06, 2011, 05:00:13 AM »

Hola otra vez,me gustaría poder mantener contacto informativo con Españoles que sean R-L21,Para intercambiar opiniones e investigar nuestro común origen,si alguien esta interesado le agradecería que me lo hiciera saber para ponernos en contacto de alguna manera,un saludo.
Hola Paco
Mi email es aryaman13atHotmail.com si quieres establecer contacto
Saludos
Hola IALEM,gracias por responder,revisa la dirección de correo que pusiste,he intentado contactar contigo y creo que no funciona.....un saludo.
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IALEM
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« Reply #344 on: May 07, 2011, 09:26:53 AM »

has reemplazado at por @? no puse la dirección exacta por precaución
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Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

rms2
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« Reply #345 on: May 22, 2011, 06:25:55 AM »

We added another L21+ member with a Spanish surname yesterday: Barraza, kit 197385. No Ysearch ID yet. As far as I can tell, he isn't able to trace his ancestry across the Pond yet.
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IALEM
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« Reply #346 on: May 22, 2011, 10:24:58 AM »

Is his ancestry in Northern Mexico? Barraza is a rather unusual surname, but it is relatively common in Durango.
For what i have searched, the origin of the surname in Spain is rather obscure, but it can be a variant of Barazar/Barrasa, all from the Basque word Baratze (orchard). Basque origin is made more probable if the subject is indeed from Durango, since that region was originally settled by Basque inmigrants early in the XVII century, and the region is full of Basque surnames among the old families.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2011, 10:28:09 AM by IALEM » Logged

Y-DNA L21+


MDKA Lope de Arriçabalaga, born c. 1390 in Azcoitia, Basque Country

rms2
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« Reply #347 on: May 22, 2011, 05:33:42 PM »

Is his ancestry in Northern Mexico? Barraza is a rather unusual surname, but it is relatively common in Durango.
For what i have searched, the origin of the surname in Spain is rather obscure, but it can be a variant of Barazar/Barrasa, all from the Basque word Baratze (orchard). Basque origin is made more probable if the subject is indeed from Durango, since that region was originally settled by Basque inmigrants early in the XVII century, and the region is full of Basque surnames among the old families.

This Barraza traces his most distant y ancestor to Louisiana, USA.
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alan trowel hands.
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« Reply #348 on: May 23, 2011, 05:58:02 PM »

Is his ancestry in Northern Mexico? Barraza is a rather unusual surname, but it is relatively common in Durango.
For what i have searched, the origin of the surname in Spain is rather obscure, but it can be a variant of Barazar/Barrasa, all from the Basque word Baratze (orchard). Basque origin is made more probable if the subject is indeed from Durango, since that region was originally settled by Basque inmigrants early in the XVII century, and the region is full of Basque surnames among the old families.

L21 really does seem to be have its best representation in and around the Basque area and in general the areas of Spain near to France.  I see that as a geographical thing more than anything else.  The project map and also Myres et al seem to imply that western France has a reasonable showing of L21. 
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« Reply #349 on: May 24, 2011, 12:07:40 PM »

The surname Barraza is most probably a variant of Barrasa as the letter "z" is often substituted in Mexico for the "s". This name originated in the municipality of Valley of Mena (Valle de Mena) which is in the province of Burgos that borders the Basque province of Vizcaya.

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