World Families Forums - Y Haplogroup Shorthand

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Author Topic: Y Haplogroup Shorthand  (Read 2461 times)
rms2
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« on: November 16, 2008, 06:04:21 PM »

Y Haplogroup and subclade designations have become so long it is easier to refer to them in a kind of shorthand, using the letter of the major y haplogroup division (the letter of the alphabet, without numbers) followed by a hyphen and the name of the SNP furthest downstream for which the person is derived (positive).

For example, an R1b1b2a1b7* (YCC Tree) is also R1b1b2a2g* (ISOGG Tree). In y haplogroup shorthand, however, he is R-U152*: R for the major y haplogroup division, U152 for the SNP furthest downstream for which he has a derived or positive result.

Got it?

Guys who are P312+ but negative for all the currently-known subclades downstream of it are R-P312*.

Guys who are U106+ but negative for everything downstream of it are R-U106*, and so on.

It seems a good system to me.

The asterisk shows that the man has had all the relevant available SNP tests and is negative for everything downstream of the SNP indicated.

FTDNA shows your shorthand designation in the upper right of your "Haplotree" page.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2008, 07:09:47 PM by rms2 » Logged

didier
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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2008, 06:26:40 PM »

I agree but I think that 23andME choice to keep with the old (2002) system is proving to be a good choice for people not aware of haplogroups (for many of them). At least in R1b subgroups it's much easier to grasp. There is a real problem for new comers to the field and nomenclature changes were far too frequent. So, your post for an explanation is certainly a good idea.

The problem with the shorthand naming is that you lose contact with the subgrouping. Only those familiar with R1b haplogroups would know that R-U106 is distinct of R-U152 , R-SRY2627 , R-L21 because those last 3 are P312+ while U106 is P312- . I would favor a simplified nomenclature  taking into account only those subclades with, say, more than 50  known cases. The others are cryptic, very interesting for the specialist (those of us discussing these issues are specialists) but  very confusing for non specialists. I can see this when I come to haplogroups that I am following from distance (like E haplogroup). Now that we know which haplogroups are the main ones we could have a "full simplified" simplified nomenclature for these and keep the shorthand names for the rare ones not included (R-M153 would be one).
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rms2
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« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2008, 05:58:30 PM »

I don't really understand how the 2002 system could be retained, since quite a few SNPs have been discovered since then. The y haplogroup shorthand might confuse newbies or those not really familiar with R, but they can be directed to the most current y haplogroup R trees. If they can see them, it shouldn't take too long to figure things out.
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Banks
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« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2008, 11:14:43 PM »

It appears to me that you specialists will be preaching to the choir because the congregation (non-specialists) will be long lost in a state of utter confusion. My cousin recently had a DNA test and I am looking for assistance in understanding it. I have no knowledge of the "longhand" let alone the shorthand of DNA classifications. I only recently learned to spell halpotype. The terms you use may as well be Greek (and they may actually be Greek). This is a highly specialized area and the jargon is incomprehensible to Joe the Plumber and to me, too.
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didier
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« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2008, 12:39:06 AM »

You are welcome . What's the haplotype of your cousin ? May be you know his haplogroup ?
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vtilroe
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« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2008, 12:50:56 AM »

I keep links to this: http://www.dna-fingerprint.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=21&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
and this: http://www.isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpR08.html
bookmarked so I know where everything sits.
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YSearch & MitoSearch: 2GXWW


yDNA: R-U106*


mtDNA: U5a1a1 (Genbank# GQ368895)


R-P312-WTY Project Admin http://tinyurl.com/daertg

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