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Author Topic: U5a, Suebi origins?  (Read 2695 times)
byakhee_2001
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« on: January 09, 2008, 11:53:30 AM »

I have Spanish origins and I am U5a, 16192T,16270T,16519C.

I have an exact HVR1 match with 48 persons. 1 of Austria, 1 Azores, 2 British Isles, 1 Denmark, 8 England, 3 France, 10 Germany, 1 Great Britain, 1 Greece, 3 Hungary, 5 Ireland, 2 Italy, 2 Portugal, 1 Russia, 1 Scotland, 2 Spain, 1 Sweden, 2 United Kingdom, 1 Wales.

We can regroup Azores with Portugal, and British Isles, England, Scotland, United Kingdom and Wales with Great Britain, and Finaly Austria with Germany. So we have 1 Denmark, 3 France, 11 Germany, 15 Great Britain, 1 Greece, 3 Hungary, 5 Ireland, 2 Italy, 3 Portugal, 1 Russia, 2 Spain, 1 Sweden.

Suebi in the classical sources is used with two different meanings: the specific tribe of Caesar's campaign, "dwelling on the Main", and "broadly, to cover a large number of tribes in central Germany." The broad view is expressed in the Germania of the Roman historian Tacitus, a basic written source for the Suebic peoples. That work states:

“ We must come now to speak of the Suebi, who do not, like the Chatti or Tencteri, constitute a single nation. They actually occupy more than half of Germany, and are divided into a number of distinct tribes under distinct names, though all generally are called Suebi. ”

The Suebi comprise the Semnones, who are "the oldest and noblest of the Suebi"; the Langobardi; the seven tribes of Jutland and Holstein: Reudigni, Aviones, Anglii, Varini, Eudoses, Suarini, Nuitones; the Hermunduri on the Elbe; three along the Danube: Naristi, Marcomanni, Quadi; the Marsigni and Buri. Then there is a mountain range, and beyond that in the drainage system of the Vistula five tribes of the Lugii including the Harii, Helvecones, Manimi, Helsii and Naharvali; the Gothones, Rugii, Lemovii along the Baltic Sea; all the states of the Suiones, located in peninsular Scandinavia; and finally the non-Germanic Aestii, and the Sitones, beyond the Aestii along the Baltic yet "continuous with the Suiones". Says Tacitus then: "Here Suebia ends."

But few clues to the identity of the Suebi are given. They can be identified by their fashion of the Suebian knot (a hair style), which "distinguishes the freeman from the slave"; in other words, was intended as a badge of social rank. The same passage points out that chiefs "use an even more elaborate style."

A second criteron for being Suebian is residence in the territory of Suebia. That country goes beyond the Germanic-speakers. It is not just that the Suebi are also all the tribes of central Germany or even a block of tribes sharing the same language and customs: "it is clear that there is no monolithic 'Suebic' group, but a series of tribes who may share some customs (for instance, warrior burials) but also vary considerably." The Suebia of Tacitus comprises the entire periphery of the Baltic Sea, including within it tribes of the Sitones, who must have resided where Lapland and Finland are now or have been, who today are speakers of Finno-Ugrian, and there has been no replacement of their language since antiquity. On the south shore of the Baltic are the Aestii, in the territory of the modern-day Baltic language speakers, or where they have been (Prussia), again equally as ancient as the Germanic-speakers.

A third criterion is sharing in the name Suebi, which is "indeed genuine and ancient." Evidently the name is multi-ethnic and cross-cultural, but there is reason to postulate an original corps of Germanic speakers who were called the Suebi, who for a time by conquest or colonization dominated the Finno-Ugrians and the Balts. The core tribe of the Suebi were the Semnones, whose name means Suebi.

In this link you can have more informations about Suebi tribes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suebi

Between 4th and 6th century AD, because of Huns, most of these Suebi tribes were forced to move. To France, Spain, Portugal, England, Italy and Balkans.

But originally the core tribes lived in Germany. About 406 AD, a part of the Suebi who stayed on the right bank of the Rhine moved to the south. First France, then Basque country, and finally found a Kingdom in the north of Spain and Portugal who lasted until 586 AD.

I am sure that German, French, Spanish and Portuguese who have same mtdna HVR1 than me descend from these Suebi.

I think that English and other nationalities have some Suebi ancestors, but from different Suebi tribes. Anglii tribe for the English for example.
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byakhee_2001
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« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2008, 06:17:11 AM »

Read this link:

http://www.brian-hamman.com/WhereAreUrsulaDescendentsFoundToday.htm

Suebi would be rather U5b.

3,4% in South Germany, 2,7% in North of Portugal, 1,5% in Galicia.

It corresponds to the migration of Suebi.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 10:16:13 AM by byakhee_2001 » Logged
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