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Author Topic: The true origin of Amerindian R*  (Read 411 times)
Maliclavelli
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« on: October 28, 2013, 03:10:19 AM »

On Anthrogenica I dealt with the problem of a possible presence of hg. R in Amerindians before Columbus, this due to the recent discover of hg. R on a sample of 24,000 years ago in Siberia. Richard Rocca noted that only an unclassified hg. R was present in the Amerindian FTDNA projet. This:

"236089 Coleman Miller, b. 1840 Unknown Origin R
12 24 15 11 12-15 12 12 13 14 13 28 16 9-9 11 12 26 14 19 30 11-12-15-15 10 11 21-21 16 15 18 19 32-37 12 12
This sample from the American Indian FTDNA Project whom Richard Rocca spoke about, labelled R, is probably R-V88+ and may have come from everywhere, even though doesn't match any haplotype found so far. Why not from Beringia?"

And tried to compare it with haplotypes found in America above all by YHRD. After I wrote this letter in replying to the quoted statement  below:

10-25-2013, 11:44 PM #167 Rathna Posts 508
Quote Originally Posted by AJL View Post
    It is dangerous to start concocting theories based on a single kit whose Y ancestor is "Unknown Origin."

    Yes, probably you are right. From the samples of YHRD seems very likely that these are R-V88+ of African origin, even though they don't match any known haplotype of African R-V88+. But the scattered presence of this haplotype overall in America shouldn't make us exclude a possible Amerindian origin.
    236089 Coleman Miller, b. 1840 Unknown Origin R
    12 24 15 11 12-15 12 12 13 14 13 28 16 9-9 11 12 26 14 19 30 11-12-15-15 10 11 21-21 16 15 18 19 32-37 12 12

    1 15 14 28 24 11 13 12 12,15 12 12 14 19 15 16 24 12 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 SRY10831

    1 of 1431 United States [African American] African - Afro-American North America

    15 14 28 24 10 13 12 12,15
    1
    1 15 14 28 24 10 13 12 12,15 12 12 14 19 15 15 23 12 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 SRY10831

    of 142 New Providence, Bahamas [Bahamian] Admixed North America

    15 14 28 24 11 13 12 12,16
    1
    1 15 14 28 24 11 13 12 12,16 12 12 14 18 14 16 23 12 12 -1 -1 -1 10 -1 SRY10831.2

    1 of 445 Brasilia, Brazil [Admixed Brazilian] Admixed Latin America

After I passed through this hypothesis:
"Why not to think that some R1b1* found in the Isles are the far relatives of those ancient Europeans who migrated to Central Asia and after to America?
122414    Lumsden         Scotland    R1b1    
13    25    15    10    13-16    12    12    11    14    13    29    15    9-10    11    12    26    15    19    29    12-12-16-16    11    11    21-21    15    17    19    16    34-34    12    11
236089    Coleman Miller, b. 1840    Unknown Origin    R    
12    24    15    11    12-15    12    12    13    14    13    28    16    9-9    11    12    26    14    19    30    11-12-15-15    10    11    21-21    16    15    18    19    32-37    12    12 "

But after I found these samples always on YHRD:
7CC6U   McCollough   USA    
12   23   15   10   13   15   12   12   12   14   13   28   16   9   10   11   12   26   14   19   29   12   12   15   15                                                                               
9UYJR   Logan   Virginia, USA    
12   25   15   10   13   14   12   12   11   14   13   28   16   9   10   11   12   26   14   19   29   12   12   15   15               
and said that the Amerindian R came from this haplotype, which by their surnames seemed of ancient European origin.

This post was deleted by whom  here is forbidden to enter to.

But the "R1b1 FTDNA project" has just this cluster in R-V88+ Cluster B2:

_R1b1c (V88+) Cluster B2
113092    Stewart    Sullivan Stewart, b.c. 1911, Tallapoosa Co., AL    Unknown Origin    R1b1    
12    23    15    10    13-15    12    12    12    13    13    27    16    9-10    11    12    26    14    19    29    12-12-15-15    11    11    21-23    15    15    18    20    32-37    12    12
                                                                  
N49650    Traylor         Unknown Origin    R1b1    
12    24    16    11    13-15    12    12    12    14    13    28    16    9-10    11    12    27    14    19    30    12-12-15-15    10    11    21-23    15    15    18    19    31-36    12    12
                  
57207    Logan    Harrison Logan b. 1795 Va.    Unknown Origin    R1b1    
12    25    15    10    13-14    12    12    11    14    13    28    16    9-10    11    12    26    14    19    29    12-12-15-15    10    11    21-23    15    15    18    20    32-37    12    12    12    8    15-16    8    10    10    8    10    10    12    21-23    15    11    12    12    13    8    13    21    20    11    12    11    13    11    12    12    13                                                                                                                                                                                                                           

« Last Edit: October 28, 2013, 03:54:42 AM by Maliclavelli » Logged

Maliclavelli


YDNA: R-S12460


MtDNA: K1a1b1e

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