I notice the map of supposedly Pictish areas (by Eoin McNeil I think it was) corresponds to 'loyalist strong holds at present. I don' know if this coincidental or suggests a connection to Scotland. I doesn't line up with the plantation to well. Then again this N.Ireland and politics is an issue that frequently influences historical analysis.
There is an even better correspondence between La Tene material and Cruithin tribes. In the earliest sources there was no single ethnicity called the Gaels. The Irish were a number of sub-ethnicities or strata described as Errain, Cruithin etc. The concept of a single Gaelic ethnicity and Gaels in general seems to have been devised in the early Medieval period by Latinate writters to create a unified national history when in reality there were several strata and many tribes and no unity. The giveaway is the name Gael is not even Irish. Its British (Welsh). The Gaelic language is very old but the concept of 'Gaels' is nowhere near as old. In general tribal people see differences rather than unity and names like Scot, Pict, Gael etc seem to not have been native terms and were used by outsiders or latinate writters to create an umbrella term.
I agree to a large extent but as you mention elsewhere the Irish had terms for foreigners or at least others not from Ireland, gall, so there must’ve been some sort of collective identity.
Of course Welsh speakers were using Prydyn (Pretani) for Pict
There actual is a word, however most people don't know it ;-) it's:
FéniThis word is the root of the later
Fian (plural
Fianna), members of a Fian/Fianna were called:
fénnidAnother good example where the word comes up is in the word for the law (Brehon law in english):
fénechas -- basically Irish/freeman's law.
Proto-Goidelic underwent a sound change where Proto-Celtic V/W (sometimes written as U) mutated to a f sound. As a result Veni -> Féni, in proto-brythonic the sound change was from a V/W -> gw
Generally it's regarded that both féni and Guoidel (old-welsh) share common root in Proto-IE.
Anyways if you look at Ptolemy/roman sources you see the word "veni" shows up as part of tribal names all over the place.
Here's some extracts from DIL: (Dictionary of Irish language -- covering old/middle irish)
fénech
o-ā (Féne) belonging to the féni ; of old or genuine Irish stock : in accordance with the customs of the féni (: clérech in follg. verse exx.) : rop f.¤ `versed in legal lore' Tec. Corm. § 6. 13 . lasan fialchas fenech ZCP x 344 § 20 . oclach ... arusc fenech (`of Irish speech ' Thurneysen, taking word as gp. But `a.f.' may be a cheville) Snedgus u. Mac R. 10.7 . a tig rig recht [leg. in rechta] fenich with the law of the féni 12.1 . ba fecht feneach (chev.), Anecd. i 73 § 214 .
fénechas
o,m. also fenchas (hence by glossators somet. confounded with senchas which was supposed to be derived from it by `cendfochrus,' the substitution of one initial for another, Laws i 32.34 Auraic. 5384 . fenchas ... is he in gnathach indiu `senchas' ACC § 1 Comm. ( LU 485 ). feanchus .i. seanchus, O'Cl.). The traditional customs and regulations of the féni taken as a whole, including the body of the ancient law and somet. the `bérla Féne' ; `native customary law', Binchy, Críth G. vocab., p. 88 . (Thurney- sen, Bürgsch. § 59 n ., renders it `Uberlieferung der Fēni, Irenrecht ', and adds that the phr. `ara-chan fēnechus' is used to introduce a legal statement couched in poetic- rhetorical style, a `roscad') : na cuic curu ata taithmechta la Feine .i. ... do reir in feinechais, Laws i 52.23 Comm. is a fenechus (.i. i ssenchus .i. ni i lleabraib ni hi cain) rosuidiged dire lethard do gradaib tuaithe, BCrólige § 5 . dianadbe feinechas (.i. madia roib riar dligidh in fenechais do damthain do), Laws iv 18.21 (20z) . Dist. from Senchus [Már] and Críth Gablach : na se ba fuilit a fut Ḟeinichais, ┐ it inann ┐ na cuig seoit fuilit isin tSenchus, ┐ na se samaisce fuilit isin Crich Gablach, O'C. 2545 (< Eg. 88 , 45 ). amhail isbeir i fut Fenechais : ni nascat cuma comorba, etc. , Laws i 186.13 . co n-abuir tall i fut Ḟeineachuis, nach dilius daghrath, etc. , ii 270.16 . a cumlechtaib Feine .i. a com- slechtib in feinechais i 182.21 . is fás fenechas i condeilgg ferbb ṅDe the common law is void in comparison with the words of God ACC 52 (= fénechas ic ferbaib Dé LU 789 ). Corm. Y 584 . tucaid a denma ainceas brethemnais do cuir [leg. chur ?] for Cumain ... iar leghud leighind ┐ nir legh Fenechas roimhe riam, co ndechaid isin tuaisceart dia foglaim, O'C. 1046 (< H 3.18 , 436 b ). isat airimda bretha rechta isin feneochus YBL 183 b 20 = IT iii 193.11 . ni dēmad fir hĒrenn fīr fear ... na feineachus flatha dūine tar ēis Fhir D. do thuitim linn ZCP x 297.29 . a lucht imdénma in ḟenchuis `ye that adorn the code of law ' Met. Dinds. iii 54.10 . Féinechas Hérenn : Clúain Húama `the Jurisprudence of Ireland-Cloyne ' Triads 12 . Cluain Lethan ardchathair ḟenechais Erenn LB 206 marg. dobreth ardchennus ┐ comhairle ┐ fenechus Érend do Morann ZCP xi 64.15 . Seanchus ┐ Feneachus na hEreann do ghlanadh ┐ do scriobhadh ar tteclamadh ... seinleabhar nEreann co haonmaighin FM 438 . oide foircetail hi ffeineachus (`i.e. , in the Brehon law,' O'Don.) FM v 1682.15 . M. Mac Aedhagain, sai Erend a mbreithemhnacht fenachais ALC ii 592.3 . breitheamhain ḟéineachais Uladh, Keat. iii 172 . conaimes gart fri féne fáth (.i. féle dhó ar a foáith do rér an ḟéneachais ona feraibh nāraibh), Ériu xiii 51.22 . la Feine ... (... .i. do reir in Feinechais), Laws i 84.23 . Transf. of foreign law and custom : Ailfrid ... ró ordnead recht ┐ féneachus na Saxan FM 900 . In wider sense : fenechus (.i. oglachus) ┐ maith do denum friumb duit traditional justice, fair dealing (?) IT iii 242.1 . Cf. cen cop fial fri fenechus `though he be not liberal to warriors ' [generous in observing custom (?). Of a niggardly satirist from whom a king is seeking hospitality], Hib. Min. 65.11 . Equated with `bérla Féne' : Berla Feine .i. in Feinechus no araile berla robui ag Feinius ar leith, Auraic. 4622 . goar .i. solus isin Fenic[h]us (no isin Breatnais) 633 . is de asbert in file do Scotaib isin ḟenechus : Conétaigti, etc. LB 146 a 29 . Cf. Bérla Féine Hérenn : Corcach (with gl. : .i. an iomat breithemhuin ... nó sgol féinechuis ann), Triads 16 .
fían
fian féne ḟéinne Fianghal Fianghail -uil Fiangaile fíangalach Fiangalaich
Keywords: driving; pur-; suing; hunting; band; warriors; warpath; band; roving; hunting; troop; fighting-men; warrior-bands; military caste; fianna; fíana; roving; band; fian; -warrior; company; number; persons; shield-bearers; game; chessmen; warrior; General; warrior-shout; fighting; field; fight; hunting-bothy; hut; shelter; encampment; huts; comrade; arms; mutual; friend; board; chess; men; idle; sport; hunting-slaughter; kill-; ing; game; rising; warriors; battle; raid; warlike; accoutrements; hunting; booth; osiers; valor; valiant; bolt; pole; pike; spear
I had come across the Feni thing before in discussion about Irish law tracts etc. It is interesting and as you say its not known widely. Was there not some sort of class terms like Grad Flaith and Grad Feine (my spellings are probably wrong) that suggest that the latter meant the ordinary people while the former meant the nobles.
As for the Goidil I thought the first part was from Gwyddel which had the root Gwydd (Irish Fid, old Celtic Vid/Ved='wood' rather than the Ven root in Feni. I had however heard that there was a connection between the element in Gwynned in Wales (I think which is from Venedotia or something like that) and the Irish Feni. I tend to think that Feni meant the ordinary people and commoner young warriors. Was there not also a term Bearla Feinne or something like that which seemed to mean 'language of the people' or something like that.
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