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Author Topic: R1b-L21* "true asterisk" DF13- people & DF63  (Read 32374 times)
rms2
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« Reply #350 on: February 02, 2013, 11:43:43 AM »

Bush, kit 31903, got a DF13- result this morning. No DF63 order yet.
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bmattox
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« Reply #351 on: February 04, 2013, 02:14:27 PM »

Bob here, from the Maddox DF13- DF63-  group. I just ordered the L459 and Z245 tests. The tests will be batched on Thursday. Happy hunting!
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k.o.gran
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« Reply #352 on: February 04, 2013, 03:20:31 PM »

Bob here, from the Maddox DF13- DF63-  group. I just ordered the L459 and Z245 tests. The tests will be batched on Thursday. Happy hunting!

Good luck Bob! This feels a bit strange to write, but let's hope for some negative results! And thank you for being a pioneer!

-Kai
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df.reynolds
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« Reply #353 on: February 05, 2013, 01:19:24 AM »

Bob here, from the Maddox DF13- DF63-  group. I just ordered the L459 and Z245 tests. The tests will be batched on Thursday. Happy hunting!
Super, look forward to seeing your results.

If you want to do some additional investigatory testing at some point, there are three other SNPs which are of interest to L21+ DF13- DF63- people.
  Z2542 (approx. equivalent to DF13)
  Z260 (approx. equivalent to L21)
  Z290 (approx. equivalent to L21)

Regards,
david
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 05:44:24 AM by df.reynolds » Logged
df.reynolds
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« Reply #354 on: February 05, 2013, 03:44:00 AM »

Bob here, from the Maddox DF13- DF63-  group. I just ordered the L459 and Z245 tests. The tests will be batched on Thursday. Happy hunting!
Super, look forward to seeing your results.

If you want to do some additional investigatory testing at some point, there are three other SNPs which are of interest to L21+ DF13- DF63- people.
  Z2542 (approx. equivalent to DF13)
  Z260 (approx. equivalent to L21)
  Z290 (approx. equivalent to L21)

Regards,
david

Late breaking news. Kit 365 (Cook) received his Z2542 result and is L21+ Z2542+ DF13- DF63-.

Z2542 sits above DF13, under L21. All of the folks that were R1b-L21* are strongly encouraged to test Z2542.

We know Z2542 is under R-L21 (rather than equivalent to it, like L459), since Kai (R-DF63) tested Z2542-.

Z2542 was submitted to the Hg R ISOGG coordinator for inclusion on the ISOGG tree. A request for primers for it was sent to Thomas Krahn on 18 Nov, so all-in-all, a very satisfactory timeline for it.


Sorry folks, please ignore the above. The kit in question is in fact DF13+, not DF13-, so the best we can say about Z2542 is that it is located at approximately R-DF13. Thanks to Thomas Krahn for identifying the error and quickly letting us know about it. Thomas said:

"DF13 is a difficult marker to score because the sequencing traces are not clean because the primers bind to all sorts of locations. We have had several revisions of primers. The ones that we use are the best but they're still not great. Our technician tried to read a not so clean trace manually but he shifted one base to the side and came to the (wrong) DF13- conclusion."

Regards,
david
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 05:45:03 AM by df.reynolds » Logged
TH63
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« Reply #355 on: February 18, 2013, 11:27:37 PM »

Sorry folks, please ignore the above. The kit in question is in fact DF13+, not DF13-, so the best we can say about Z2542 is that it is located at approximately R-DF13. Thanks to Thomas Krahn for identifying the error and quickly letting us know about it. Thomas said:

"DF13 is a difficult marker to score because the sequencing traces are not clean because the primers bind to all sorts of locations. We have had several revisions of primers. The ones that we use are the best but they're still not great. Our technician tried to read a not so clean trace manually but he shifted one base to the side and came to the (wrong) DF13- conclusion."

Regards,
david


Does this suggest that others in L21+ may have received a DF13- result due to lab error, because it is a "difficult marker to score"? It is not clear to me how this error in Cook's kit was discovered, what triggered this finding.
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FTDNA tested R-L21, DF13-, DF63-
Kit N49494
Y-DNA67 match to Wildes/Wilds surname
Member of FTDNA projects: Wilde, R-L21-Plus
k.o.gran
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« Reply #356 on: February 20, 2013, 04:05:22 PM »

Does this suggest that others in L21+ may have received a DF13- result due to lab error, because it is a "difficult marker to score"? It is not clear to me how this error in Cook's kit was discovered, what triggered this finding.

Hi Todd,

Lab errors are always a possibility, but it's my opinion that they are quite far apart. The error was discovered because he, as a DF13-, tested positive for a SNP (Z2542) that was believed to by phylogenetically equivalent to DF13. If that result had been correct, it would have been sort of a big deal, as it would split those SNPs. Thomas Krahn did a recheck, and it turned out the result was erroneous.

-Kai
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bmattox
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« Reply #357 on: March 04, 2013, 10:39:18 AM »

I have the results of one of my snps. I am L459+, now awaiting the results of the Z245. Any interpretations are surely appreciated. Take care. Bob.
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k.o.gran
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« Reply #358 on: March 04, 2013, 02:44:16 PM »

I have the results of one of my snps. I am L459+, now awaiting the results of the Z245. Any interpretations are surely appreciated. Take care. Bob.

Hi Bob,

L459+ is in line with all previous results, so that means it is still phylogenetically equivalent of L21.

-Kai
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bmattox
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« Reply #359 on: March 05, 2013, 10:31:34 AM »

Thank you Kai.
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erwangery
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« Reply #360 on: March 08, 2013, 06:41:52 PM »

Hi, I am positive for cts6919+.

Erwan (kit n66966)
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k.o.gran
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« Reply #361 on: March 09, 2013, 06:11:08 AM »

Hi, I am positive for cts6919+.

Erwan (kit n66966)

Hi Erwan,

Yes, you and kit 54798 Franklin are our newest CTS6919+ kits. Along with N110523 Braunhofer, these are the only three kits known to date that are CTS6919+. My result (191950 Lowden) also came back, but it came back negative. Your genetic distance from Franklin is enough for ISOGG inclusion, so I sent an email to ISOGG just now, requesting that CTS6919 is added to the tree.

Thank you for being a pioneer!

-Kai
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« Reply #362 on: March 13, 2013, 04:55:36 PM »

I have the results of one of my snps. I am L459+, now awaiting the results of the Z245. Any interpretations are surely appreciated. Take care. Bob.

Hi Bob,

I see that you are now listed as Z245+. That result is also in line with previous results. So L21=L459=Z245 still. From what I know, you're only the second L21** testing for both those two.

-Kai
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bmattox
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« Reply #363 on: March 18, 2013, 08:54:14 AM »

Thanks Kai. Any ideas on what might be next for me? Thanks. Bob.
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k.o.gran
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« Reply #364 on: March 18, 2013, 02:45:04 PM »

Thanks Kai. Any ideas on what might be next for me? Thanks. Bob.

I'm not entirely sure, but I believe Z260, Z290 and Z2542 are your options. Can anyone else confirm? David R.? Mike W.?

Keep in mind that it is very likely that you test Z260+, Z290+ and Z2542-. However, should you test differently, you will make quite an impact on the L21 haplotree.

These are the only test results I can find for other L21** kits for these SNPs:
94428 - Meadows: Z290+
37201 - Berry: Z290+
N80403 - Bishop: Z290+

-Kai
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« Reply #365 on: October 30, 2013, 05:04:17 PM »

All quiet on this thread so I gather there have been no new findings lately.

One of my Y-DNA cousins has had several additional tests done on his kit with no surprises. Here are his complete results so far:

L21+, L459+, Z245+, Z260+, DF13-, DF63-, Z2542-

Still pretty "lonely" in this group!

Todd
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FTDNA tested R-L21, DF13-, DF63-
Kit N49494
Y-DNA67 match to Wildes/Wilds surname
Member of FTDNA projects: Wilde, R-L21-Plus
rms2
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« Reply #366 on: October 30, 2013, 09:07:30 PM »

All quiet on this thread so I gather there have been no new findings lately.

One of my Y-DNA cousins has had several additional tests done on his kit with no surprises. Here are his complete results so far:

L21+, L459+, Z245+, Z260+, DF13-, DF63-, Z2542-

Still pretty "lonely" in this group!

Todd

We have a new R1b-L21 subforum. There is a DF63 thread there you might want to try.
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