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Author Topic: New SNP L705.2, downstream of L513+ (and L21+)  (Read 1564 times)
Mike Walsh
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« on: November 14, 2011, 01:23:29 PM »

A couple of months ago, GregRM posted that an anonymous researcher and he had found an SNP L705. This was identified in a I-M223 person who had a huge Y DNA deletion of some kind.

Greg noticed that the L513+ person in the 1000 Human Genome project also had it. It is NA12399 member of the 1000 Human Genome Project (CEU - a Caucasian from Utah.)

Out of craziness, I ordered and am found L705+ also although I have no relatives that I know of in Utah.

MJost was kind enough to run blasts on all of the WTY participants that were tested for the particular segment where L705 sits. He did this because that segment is unstable and we wanted to look for parallel L705+ readings. He found none, so as far as I know L705+ is found only in the I-M223 guy and in L513.

Since I've been very fortunate in find folks for my little group that we call 11-13 Combo B-2, I asked them to test as well as other clusters within 11-13 Combo, which is pretty solidly L513+ other than the P314.2 people.

The other clusters and subclades L193 and P66 have all come back negative for L705.  That's actually beautiful, because 11-13 Combo B-2 is coming back L705+.  Besides the HG project guy from Utah, here are the known L705.2+ people.


f178598___ Adams____________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ YEC3U___ England, West Midlands, Shropshire
f36619____ Banks____________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ VGX5F___ England
f85844____ Bergeron_________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ UGKAE___ France, Poitou-Charentes, Charente-Maritime, La Rochelle
f202969___ Edwards__________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ JWVKJ___ zzzUnkOrigin
f35601____ Lewis____________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ VYSQJ___ Wales, South, Glanmorganshire
f82655____ Morris___________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ EF7VR___ Wales, South, Monmouthshire, Tintern Parva, Piercefield
f60411____ Philips__________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ BJZWF___ England
fN29541___ Sunesson(Tibbhult)_______ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ 7F56N___ Sweden, Kalmar län, Tibbhult
fN54638___ Walsh____________________ R-L21/L513/L705______________ 1113-B-2________ RXYKH___ Ireland, Leinster, Co. Kilkenny (possibly South Wales before that)


Using Ken Nordtvedt's methods for 67 length haplotypes, the coalescence age of the above group is 864 AD, with a confidence range of 600 AD to 1100 AD. These estimates reflect the "time of expansion", not the actual Most Recent Common Ancestor. For some reason, starting during this timeframe, this lineage had a population spurt that gave it enough geographic or cultural safety and diversity to survive.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 01:34:23 PM by Mikewww » Logged

R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
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« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2011, 02:55:46 PM »

any thoughts on a French, or Scandinavian continental source.
(or any place else)
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R-DF13**(L21>DF13)
M42+, M45+, M526+, M74+, M89+, M9+, M94+, P108+, P128+, P131+, P132+, P133+, P134+, P135+, P136+, P138+, P139+, P14+, P140+, P141+, P143+, P145+, P146+, P148+, P149+, P151+, P157+, P158+, P159+, P160+, P161+, P163+, P166+, P187+, P207+, P224+, P226+, P228+, P229+, P230+, P231+, P232+, P233+, P234+, P235+, P236+, P237+, P238+, P239+, P242+, P243+, P244+, P245+, P280+, P281+, P282+, P283+, P284+, P285+, P286+, P294+, P295+, P297+, P305+, P310+, P311+, P312+, P316+, M173+, M269+, M343+, P312+, L21+, DF13+, M207+, P25+, L11+, L138+, L141+, L15+, L150+, L16+, L23+, L51+, L52+, M168+, M173+, M207+, M213+, M269+, M294+, M299+, M306+, M343+, P69+, P9.1+, P97+, PK1+, SRY10831.1+, L21+, L226-, M37-, M222-, L96-, L193-, L144-, P66-, SRY2627-, M222-, DF49-, L371-, DF41-, L513-, L555-, L1335-, L1406-, Z251-, L526-, L130-, L144-, L159.2-, L192.1-, L193-, L195-, L96-, DF21-, Z255-, DF23-, DF1-, Z253-, M37-, M65-, M73-, M18-, M126-, M153-, M160-, P66-

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« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2011, 07:13:19 PM »

any thoughts on a French, or Scandinavian continental source.
(or any place else)
I don't know. I really don't. I'm just hoping to find more and more haplotypes until the picture becomes clear.

The preponderance of the haplotypes are from Wales of Welsh surnames or English, but generally towards the West Midlands.  To me that implies old Briton, but this paternal lineage was having it success spurt at the same time the old Britons should have been suffering at least until those in Wales joined up with the Normans.

If we had the same testing penetration in Northern France as the Isles I'd feel more comfortable about making a conclusion.  The key seems to be is Bergeron an Irish historic period mercenary or not or he is from "home."  His branch is not far enough back in age to be a Breton exile from Wales and England, but to call one haplotype a "trend" is beyond the pale.  We have some other L513+ L705- people who think they are from France but these are mostly three way bankshots based on surname confluences and associations.

We do have one or two L513+ L705- guys that are current continental citizens but I don't know of three or four makes a trend either.

Then there is the L705+ guy in Sweden. He actually is in Sweden and has his family traced back to the 1500's closer to the Baltic than to the straights or the North Sea.  Seems like a long way for Vikings to bring people back from Wales.  I also don't keep hearing and reading that the Vikings did not impact Wales much.
http://www.family-ancestry.co.uk/history/vikings/wales/
Again, one does not a trend make.

I think a key location for me will be Glamorgan. There is something a bit eerie about the old folklore of Walsh and Barrett and the "Lords of Glamorgan" to go with the probable L705 people named Morgan and the other Welsh L705 in the area of South Wales. We have the fun of having our own "12 knights" story.

On the other hand there are some parts of L513+ L705- that sound pretty Gaelic, like the Airghelli II folks (Maguires of Fermanagh and Burns of Monaghan.) I hate to sound greedy, but I need another SNP or two between L513 and L705 to see how the clusters group together.... well that, and a huge French citizen based DNA project.

« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 07:21:51 PM by Mikewww » Logged

R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2011, 02:58:57 PM »

That is hard to interpret but the only thing connecting England, Wales and NW France in that timeframe would seem to me to be the Normans or their Breton allies in 1066. However, that might change as the sample grows.  Do we have an interclade?
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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2011, 07:06:30 PM »

That is hard to interpret but the only thing connecting England, Wales and NW France in that timeframe would seem to me to be the Normans or their Breton allies in 1066. However, that might change as the sample grows.  Do we have an interclade?

Mike,

It would appear to be Cambro Norman in origin. The Norman invasion of Ireland began in 1169.
The Walshes were one of the first Cambro Norman families to arrive and quickly became Gaelicised.
http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~walsh/folklore.html
http://rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlkik/ihm/invasion.

The Walshes and Barretts were well represented in the first wave.
"Pembrokeshire families include: Barry, Bryan, Barrett, Carew, Caunteton (now Condon), Hay, Keating, Mayler, Roche, Russell, Stackpoole, Scurlock, and Walsh. "


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R1b1a2a1a1b4  L459+ L21+ DF21+ DF13+ U198- U106- P66- P314.2- M37- M222- L96- L513- L48- L44- L4- L226- L2- L196- L195- L193- L192.1- L176.2- L165- L159.2- L148- L144- L130- L1-
Paternal L21* DF21


Maternal H1C1



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« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2011, 07:59:07 PM »

any thoughts on a French, or Scandinavian continental source.
(or any place else)
I don't know. I really don't. I'm just hoping to find more and more haplotypes until the picture becomes clear.
Oh my...... I wasn't expecting this. My cluster is pretty well Wales/West Midlands (Eng) based but we have the outsider from Sweden who confirmed as L705.2+. The Swede is:

fN29541 Sunesson(Tibbhult) - Sweden, Kalmar län, Tibbhult

Sunesson's ancestry goes to Ostergotland as well as adjacent areas.

Now for the surprise. I was just updating L21 files and I looked at the Finland FTDNA project. The spreadsheet I copy into automatically checks for "11-13" people so it flagged a new guy. He is not deep clade tested but he is a clear fit for 1113-B-2 which has been all L513+ L705.2+ so far.

f128145 Holmberg(Tammisaari) - Finland, Tammisaari

He matches the cluster signature of 617=13 YCAII=18,23 19/394=15 406s1=11 444=13, mostly slower markers.

His closest match in our group is a GD of 6 at 67 is this guy:

f1761 Traylor - England

I wasn't really expecting to have this quandry in my own cluster.

The timing of the Normans coming into England, then Wales, is only the next 150 years after the end of the 250 year Viking Age. Both movements could explain this cluster of Wales/West Midlands folks that also have a Frenchman and two Fenno-Scandinavian folks in the mix. Of course the Viking Age would be the opposite direction movement.. with the thralls thing as a possibility.

I just don't think the TMRCA estimates reach back to Anglo-Saxon era so I don't think the Frenchman is explained as a Breton / Briton exile from England works. It is still a possibility, though.

I think the two primary alternatives are
1. Welsh/Britons expanding with some taken back to Viking home-lands, but the majority expanding in Wales in alliances with the Normans and then in part joining the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.
2. Scandinavians who made it to France as Normans and then onto England and Wales, where they had a heyday in the Norman Marcher Lord period, including the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.

Those are the two I think of, but just because they are more well-known doesn't mean they are the only likely options.  Let me ask - are there other historic period movements/exchanges between the Baltic area and Wales?
« Last Edit: December 03, 2011, 08:13:02 PM by Mikewww » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2011, 05:26:54 PM »

Any opinions on this?

Since we now have 12 confirmed L705.2+ people to go with our 53 confirmed L193+ people I thought that might be enough to do TMRCA (Time to Most Recent Common Ancestor) estimates. These are only two SNP marked clusters of L513.

Here is an interclade age for the MRCA of L705 and and L193.

L705 & L193 TMRCA Age______________2.3 __  (3.1-1.5)

This kind of puts a floor on L513's TMRCA at 1500 years ago.
Quote
TMRCA with DF23(M222) TMRCA Age__5.1 __  (6.5-3.6)
TMRCA with DF21 TMRCA Age________3.7 __  (4.9-2.6)
TMRCA with Z255(L159) TMRCA Age__3.5 __  (4.5-2.4)
 TMRCA with Z253(L226) TMRCA Age__3.1 __  (4.1-2.1)
We can see from the L513 pairing with Z253 that their MRCA can't be any older than 4100 years before present. That's the upper end of the youngest pair.

We have L513 cornered as being between 4100 and 1500 years old. We can compare this with the "coalescence" age which should be more related to the time of initial expansion for L513, not necessarily the first L513 guy.

L513 Coalescence Age_______________2.5 __  (2.8-2.2)

The L513 most recent common ancestor might have occured shortly before 500 BC and then pretty quickly the family began expanding nicely. For what reasons I don't know. We have a lot of British Isles people, but a couple of Frenchmen, a German, some Benelux and a Scandinavian too. You can find the other clusters of L513 here. They are scattered all over the Isles except Connacht.
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/R-L21-1113Combo/default.aspx?section=yresults

From a genealogical perspective, perhaps the below numbers are more interesting as they are coalescence ages for L705 and L193. They do NOT represent the earliest L705 man or the earliest L193 man. They represent an age of expansion. L705 and L193 must have been expanding rapidly for about 1000 years ago and hadn't faced a catastrophic bottleneck since.

L705 Coalescence Age_______________1.0 __  (1.3-0.8)

L193 Coalescence Age_______________1.0 __  (1.1-0.8)

L513 has about 20 some odd clusters. The two we have marked off with SNPs were expanding after a bottleneck (or their births) about 1000 years ago.  The L193 guys seem to be concentrated in the Scottish Borders area while the L705 guys are being found mainly in Wales/W.England with some odds and ends from France and Scandinavia. The L193 guys are quite numerous.

It seems like we might have been some breed of Britons that had a heyday when allied with the Normans in the Marches.

« Last Edit: December 13, 2011, 05:47:30 PM by Mikewww » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2012, 12:23:07 PM »

The number of L705.2+ folks has grown steadily, including a Frenchman and a Swede but one perplexing issue has been two folks that looked like 1113-B-2 haplotype signatures but were L705.2-. They were GD'd of 10 and 11 from the modal so perhaps they are just outside of range of the L705.2 MRCA.

We've had a nice break through!  One of the L705.2- guys came up L706.2+. Thomas Krahn told us that all of the L705.2+ guys were also L706.2+. I went a head and formally tested to make it official so I'm L705.2+ L706.2+.

We now know that L706.2 is older and it might be the true marker for B-2, or it could be a little bigger.
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« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2012, 12:02:33 PM »

any thoughts on a French, or Scandinavian continental source.
(or any place else)
I don't know. I really don't. I'm just hoping to find more and more haplotypes until the picture becomes clear.
Oh my...... I wasn't expecting this. My cluster is pretty well Wales/West Midlands (Eng) based but we have the outsider from Sweden who confirmed as L705.2+. The Swede is:

fN29541 Sunesson(Tibbhult) - Sweden, Kalmar län, Tibbhult

Sunesson's ancestry goes to Ostergotland as well as adjacent areas.

Now for the surprise. I was just updating L21 files and I looked at the Finland FTDNA project. The spreadsheet I copy into automatically checks for "11-13" people so it flagged a new guy. He is not deep clade tested but he is a clear fit for 1113-B-2 which has been all L513+ L705.2+ so far.

f128145 Holmberg(Tammisaari) - Finland, Tammisaari

He matches the cluster signature of 617=13 YCAII=18,23 19/394=15 406s1=11 444=13, mostly slower markers.

His closest match in our group is a GD of 6 at 67 is this guy:

f1761 Traylor - England

I wasn't really expecting to have this quandry in my own cluster.

The timing of the Normans coming into England, then Wales, is only the next 150 years after the end of the 250 year Viking Age. Both movements could explain this cluster of Wales/West Midlands folks that also have a Frenchman and two Fenno-Scandinavian folks in the mix. Of course the Viking Age would be the opposite direction movement.. with the thralls thing as a possibility.

I just don't think the TMRCA estimates reach back to Anglo-Saxon era so I don't think the Frenchman is explained as a Breton / Briton exile from England works. It is still a possibility, though.

I think the two primary alternatives are
1. Welsh/Britons expanding with some taken back to Viking home-lands, but the majority expanding in Wales in alliances with the Normans and then in part joining the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.
2. Scandinavians who made it to France as Normans and then onto England and Wales, where they had a heyday in the Norman Marcher Lord period, including the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.

Those are the two I think of, but just because they are more well-known doesn't mean they are the only likely options.  Let me ask - are there other historic period movements/exchanges between the Baltic area and Wales?

I was watching a History of Britain dvd and they talked about the English expansion into Wales. There was a series of strategic English castles built in Wales which oversaw the people,reducing the Welsh people to second class citizens.

"a succession of disputes, including the imprisonment of Llywelyn's wife Eleanor, daughter of Simon de Montfort, culminated in the first invasion by King Edward I of England.[57] As a result of military defeat, the Treaty of Aberconwy exacted Llywelyn's fealty to England in 1277.[57] Peace was short lived and, with the 1282 Edwardian conquest, the rule of the Welsh princes permanently ended. With Llywelyn's death and his brother prince Dafydd's execution, the few remaining Welsh lords did homage for their lands to Edward I. Llywelyn's head was carried through London on a spear; his baby daughter Gwenllian was locked in the priory at Sempringham, where she remained until her death 54 years later.

"To help maintain his dominance, Edward constructed a series of great stone castles. Beaumaris, Caernarfon and Conwy. His son, the future King Edward II of England, was born at Edward's new castle at Caernarfon in 1284.[59] He became the first English Prince of Wales, not as an infant, but in 1301."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wales
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 12:24:34 PM by OConnor » Logged

R1b1a2a1a1b4


R-DF13**(L21>DF13)
M42+, M45+, M526+, M74+, M89+, M9+, M94+, P108+, P128+, P131+, P132+, P133+, P134+, P135+, P136+, P138+, P139+, P14+, P140+, P141+, P143+, P145+, P146+, P148+, P149+, P151+, P157+, P158+, P159+, P160+, P161+, P163+, P166+, P187+, P207+, P224+, P226+, P228+, P229+, P230+, P231+, P232+, P233+, P234+, P235+, P236+, P237+, P238+, P239+, P242+, P243+, P244+, P245+, P280+, P281+, P282+, P283+, P284+, P285+, P286+, P294+, P295+, P297+, P305+, P310+, P311+, P312+, P316+, M173+, M269+, M343+, P312+, L21+, DF13+, M207+, P25+, L11+, L138+, L141+, L15+, L150+, L16+, L23+, L51+, L52+, M168+, M173+, M207+, M213+, M269+, M294+, M299+, M306+, M343+, P69+, P9.1+, P97+, PK1+, SRY10831.1+, L21+, L226-, M37-, M222-, L96-, L193-, L144-, P66-, SRY2627-, M222-, DF49-, L371-, DF41-, L513-, L555-, L1335-, L1406-, Z251-, L526-, L130-, L144-, L159.2-, L192.1-, L193-, L195-, L96-, DF21-, Z255-, DF23-, DF1-, Z253-, M37-, M65-, M73-, M18-, M126-, M153-, M160-, P66-

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« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2012, 09:42:15 AM »

any thoughts on a French, or Scandinavian continental source.
(or any place else)
I don't know. I really don't. I'm just hoping to find more and more haplotypes until the picture becomes clear.
Oh my...... I wasn't expecting this. My cluster is pretty well Wales/West Midlands (Eng) based but we have the outsider from Sweden who confirmed as L705.2+. The Swede is:

fN29541 Sunesson(Tibbhult) - Sweden, Kalmar län, Tibbhult

Sunesson's ancestry goes to Ostergotland as well as adjacent areas.

Now for the surprise. I was just updating L21 files and I looked at the Finland FTDNA project. The spreadsheet I copy into automatically checks for "11-13" people so it flagged a new guy. He is not deep clade tested but he is a clear fit for 1113-B-2 which has been all L513+ L705.2+ so far.

f128145 Holmberg(Tammisaari) - Finland, Tammisaari

He matches the cluster signature of 617=13 YCAII=18,23 19/394=15 406s1=11 444=13, mostly slower markers.

His closest match in our group is a GD of 6 at 67 is this guy:

f1761 Traylor - England

I wasn't really expecting to have this quandry in my own cluster.

The timing of the Normans coming into England, then Wales, is only the next 150 years after the end of the 250 year Viking Age. Both movements could explain this cluster of Wales/West Midlands folks that also have a Frenchman and two Fenno-Scandinavian folks in the mix. Of course the Viking Age would be the opposite direction movement.. with the thralls thing as a possibility.

I just don't think the TMRCA estimates reach back to Anglo-Saxon era so I don't think the Frenchman is explained as a Breton / Briton exile from England works. It is still a possibility, though.

I think the two primary alternatives are
1. Welsh/Britons expanding with some taken back to Viking home-lands, but the majority expanding in Wales in alliances with the Normans and then in part joining the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.
2. Scandinavians who made it to France as Normans and then onto England and Wales, where they had a heyday in the Norman Marcher Lord period, including the Cambro-Norman movement into Ireland.

Those are the two I think of, but just because they are more well-known doesn't mean they are the only likely options.  Let me ask - are there other historic period movements/exchanges between the Baltic area and Wales?

I was watching a History of Britain dvd and they talked about the English expansion into Wales. There was a series of strategic English castles built in Wales which oversaw the people,reducing the Welsh people to second class citizens.

"a succession of disputes, including the imprisonment of Llywelyn's wife Eleanor, daughter of Simon de Montfort, culminated in the first invasion by King Edward I of England.[57] As a result of military defeat, the Treaty of Aberconwy exacted Llywelyn's fealty to England in 1277.[57] Peace was short lived and, with the 1282 Edwardian conquest, the rule of the Welsh princes permanently ended. With Llywelyn's death and his brother prince Dafydd's execution, the few remaining Welsh lords did homage for their lands to Edward I. Llywelyn's head was carried through London on a spear; his baby daughter Gwenllian was locked in the priory at Sempringham, where she remained until her death 54 years later.

"To help maintain his dominance, Edward constructed a series of great stone castles. Beaumaris, Caernarfon and Conwy. His son, the future King Edward II of England, was born at Edward's new castle at Caernarfon in 1284.[59] He became the first English Prince of Wales, not as an infant, but in 1301."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wales
I guess I should not  an Old English ancestry as an alternative. For example, my family's story is their home was destroyed and lands taken by Cromwell and given to English supporters. A couple of hundred years later my MDKA immigrated from the same lands. It is not impossible for him to be of an English heritage. They were in the area.

On the other hand, the Y DNA lineages of L705.2 trace neatly from two different families in Ireland (Walsh and Barrett) back to Wales at about the right time for the Cambro-Norman Invasion of Ireland c. 1170 AD. This would infer these folks were in Ireland long before the Cromwell anyway.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2012, 09:44:44 AM by Mikewww » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2012, 04:37:02 PM »

RMS,

Could you add two new categories under "Qb. R-L513..."  ?

They are official in ISOGG. http://isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpR.html
Quote
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3  L706.2
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3a  L705.2

L706.2 is a parallel subclade to L193 and P66 (actually L69.5 if it was stable enough). L705.2 has about ten people and L706.2+ L705.2- has two.   If that's too much, can you just add L706.2?

I'm getting ready to move some confirmed L513+ (therefore L21+ DF13+ as well) people over to the L21 project and we might as well set this up from the git go.

BTW, thanks for all of the subgrouping maintenance. It's time consuming, especially when the official FTDNA Haplotree is way behind like it is now.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2012, 04:38:07 PM by Mikewww » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2012, 06:42:50 PM »

RMS,

Could you add two new categories under "Qb. R-L513..."  ?

They are official in ISOGG. http://isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpR.html
Quote
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3  L706.2
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3a  L705.2

L706.2 is a parallel subclade to L193 and P66 (actually L69.5 if it was stable enough). L705.2 has about ten people and L706.2+ L705.2- has two.   If that's too much, can you just add L706.2?

I'm getting ready to move some confirmed L513+ (therefore L21+ DF13+ as well) people over to the L21 project and we might as well set this up from the git go.

BTW, thanks for all of the subgrouping maintenance. It's time consuming, especially when the official FTDNA Haplotree is way behind like it is now.

No problem, Mike. To save me some time, could you send me the kit numbers of all those who are positive for L706.2 and L705.2?
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« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2012, 06:56:26 PM »

RMS,

Could you add two new categories under "Qb. R-L513..."  ?

They are official in ISOGG. http://isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpR.html
Quote
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3  L706.2
R1b1a2a1a1b4c3a  L705.2

L706.2 is a parallel subclade to L193 and P66 (actually L69.5 if it was stable enough). L705.2 has about ten people and L706.2+ L705.2- has two.   If that's too much, can you just add L706.2?

I'm getting ready to move some confirmed L513+ (therefore L21+ DF13+ as well) people over to the L21 project and we might as well set this up from the git go.

BTW, thanks for all of the subgrouping maintenance. It's time consuming, especially when the official FTDNA Haplotree is way behind like it is now.

No problem, Mike. To save me some time, could you send me the kit numbers of all those who are positive for L706.2 and L705.2?
Will do.
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R1b-L21>L513(DF1)>S6365>L705.2(&CTS11744,CTS6621)
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