Gist R1b: Finding the Y Haplogroups of Ancestors Outside Your Own Y-DNA Line

[rms2]

I am interested in collecting, in a manner of speaking, the y haplogroups of male ancestors not in my own y-dna line, that is, of the fathers of the females from whom I descend. Thus far, I have two confirmed in my basket, both on my father's side: Washburn, which, it turns out, is I1 (I-M253), and Holmes, which is E1b1b (E-M215).

My mother's maiden surname was Gist. Checking the Gist DNA project, I noticed that its "Group 4" lists my most distant Gist ancestor as its most distant y-dna ancestor. The listed y haplogroup is R1b1a2, and apparently neither of the two entries has been SNP tested. The haplotype borders on the N-S Cluster, however, with 437=15, 448=18, and H4=10. It is one off the N-S Cluster, which is characterized by 437=14, as well as 448=18 and H4=10. That Gist haplotype is close. Could it be Z196+, Z209+, etc.? Maybe.

Anyway, I am trying to confirm the relationship right now.

Sadly, my mom's last remaining brother passed away back in 2008. Although I had intended to ask him to have his y-dna tested, I never did. I regret that.

Have you had any luck finding the y haplogroups of the fathers of your female ancestors?

It's fun to try.

[Jean M]

That is an unusual name. Have you looked at the distribution in the UK in 1881. It is solidly SW England.

[rms2]

That is an unusual name. Have you looked at the distribution in the UK in 1881. It is solidly SW England.

As a matter of fact I have. It is unusual.

It is an old surname in North America and, fortunately, pretty well documented (unlike my own y-dna line).

The wife of my immigrant Gist ancestor was Edith Cromwell, the niece of the Oliver Cromwell, btw.

[Jean M]

Oh wow!

[seferhabahir]

Have you had any luck finding the y haplogroups of the fathers of your female ancestors?

It's fun to try.

Yes, I have tried this. I convinced my cousin (son of my mother's brother) to test after some hard arm-twisting. Even considered doing a WTY, but it appears they need a new sample and I doubt I will get him to agree to another cheek swipe (fear of unintended information disclosure). Anyway, my maternal grandfather Y-DNA turned out to be J-M410 [J2a*].

[rms2]

Have you had any luck finding the y haplogroups of the fathers of your female ancestors?

It's fun to try.

Yes, I have tried this. I convinced my cousin (son of my mother's brother) to test after some hard arm-twisting. Even considered doing a WTY, but it appears they need a new sample and I doubt I will get him to agree to another cheek swipe (fear of unintended information disclosure). Anyway, my maternal grandfather Y-DNA turned out to be J-M410 [J2a*].

Very cool!

I especially like finding the ones that are not R1b; not that I have anything against R1b, obviously. It's just kind of exotic to find some other y haplogroups in one's pedigree.

[rms2]

Oh wow!

I need to correct that, Jean. Edith Cromwell was the daughter of Oliver Cromwell's cousin, Sir Oliver Cromwell. I knew they were related, but I thought I remembered that she was his niece.

[Curtis Pigman(Pigmon)]

I am interested in collecting, in a manner of speaking, the y haplogroups of male ancestors not in my own y-dna line, that is, of the fathers of the females from whom I descend. Thus far, I have two confirmed in my basket, both on my father's side: Washburn, which, it turns out, is I1 (I-M253), and Holmes, which is E1b1b (E-M215).

My mother's maiden surname was Gist. Checking the Gist DNA project, I noticed that its "Group 4" lists my most distant Gist ancestor as its most distant y-dna ancestor. The listed y haplogroup is R1b1a2, and apparently neither of the two entries has been SNP tested. The haplotype borders on the N-S Cluster, however, with 437=15, 448=18, and H4=10. It is one off the N-S Cluster, which is characterized by 437=14, as well as 448=18 and H4=10. That Gist haplotype is close. Could it be Z196+, Z209+, etc.? Maybe.

Anyway, I am trying to confirm the relationship right now.

Sadly, my mom's last remaining brother passed away back in 2008. Although I had intended to ask him to have his y-dna tested, I never did. I regret that.

Have you had any luck finding the y haplogroups of the fathers of your female ancestors?

It's fun to try.

My paternal Grandmother's surname was Hays and I am  finding oddly enough that most Hays (Hay in Scotland) are extremely close to my y-dna numbers!   

Also I looked up the Gist study and I match exactly with the first kit in group 1 as well as very close to the others of group 1.

[rms2]

I heard from somebody from the Gist DNA project, and it looks like the folks in Group 2 are the ones I am looking for, not those in Group 4. Apparently those in Group 2 actually have the good paper trails to my most distant Gist ancestor.

Well, I'm making progress in sorting it out.

[secherbernard]

Have you had any luck finding the y haplogroups of the fathers of your female ancestors?

It's fun to try.

Yes Rich, I have tested the brother of my mother. The paternal name of my mother is Rochais and its origine is in the south of the mouth of the Loire river. He is I1-M253, and I have to order a deep clade test to know more about this line.

[eochaidh]

My theory is that if your from Western Europe, you probably have all the known Y-Haplogroups in your ancestry. I'm 75% Irish, Scots-Irish and 25% French-Canadian, so I'd imagine that I have quite a few R-L21+ lines.

Anyway, I went searching...

My maternal grandfather was an Erskine from Belfast and the only Erskine from Belfast I found was an L21.

My paternal grandmather was a Quinn from Co. Derry and the closes Derry Quinn I could find was a G2a3b1a. Most of the Quinns from Tyrone, Donegal and nearby were L21 or M222, but you never know.

I've got Taaffes fro Co. Dublin and Co. Louth and the ones I found were R1b basic.

My mom aslo had McDonalds on her side and they're R1a, R1b and I found an R-176+.

On the French-Canadian side I wasn't surprised not to find a Coursolle, but I was very surprised not to find any Richard testers! I found a Paquin who was U152.

None of these are for certain, but from what I've seen, the Erskines and Taaffes have always been R1b.

I should check projects (duh!) instead of just Ysearch and the French Heritage site.

[NealtheRed]

My theory is that if your from Western Europe, you probably have all the known Y-Haplogroups in your ancestry. I'm 75% Irish, Scots-Irish and 25% French-Canadian, so I'd imagine that I have quite a few R-L21+ lines.

Anyway, I went searching...

My maternal grandfather was an Erskine from Belfast and the only Erskine from Belfast I found was an L21.

My paternal grandmather was a Quinn from Co. Derry and the closes Derry Quinn I could find was a G2a3b1a. Most of the Quinns from Tyrone, Donegal and nearby were L21 or M222, but you never know.

I've got Taaffes fro Co. Dublin and Co. Louth and the ones I found were R1b basic.

My mom aslo had McDonalds on her side and they're R1a, R1b and I found an R-176+.

On the French-Canadian side I wasn't surprised not to find a Coursolle, but I was very surprised not to find any Richard testers! I found a Paquin who was U152.

None of these are for certain, but from what I've seen, the Erskines and Taaffes have always been R1b.

I should check projects (duh!) instead of just Ysearch and the French Heritage site.

Erskine is a Lowland Scottish name, I think. There is also one who plays for the Washington Capitals (if you follow the NHL Playoffs).

[eochaidh]

Erskine is a Lowland Scottish name, I think. There is also one who plays for the Washington Capitals (if you follow the NHL Playoffs).

That NHL John Erskine could easily be an Erskine from my line. He looks very much like my great uncle. Thanks for the tip. The photo jumped out to me. He's from Ontario, though.

My Erskine line is actually directly related to John Erskine the 17th Earl of Mar. His grandson, James Erskine, was given lands in Augher, Co. Tyrone in the early 1600s. My family was in Tyrone until the early 1800s and then moved to Co. Down. None of this get's me anything! :) I hear my great grandfather was very proud, though.

Yea, they were from Renfrew and Clackmannan. Actually, they were very prominent in Scots History. The last Erskine I spoke with was my mom's second cousin, Herbert Erskine, in 1992. I was in Belfast at the time and he lived in Crumlin nearby. He was about 84, then so.... My mom also had a first cousin who lived in Maryland, but I don't know him.

I have Erskine Mar & Kellie tattooed on my right shoulder around a Celtic knot  :)