World Families Forums - The ancientness of R1a1a (M17)

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
July 11, 2014, 05:29:56 AM
Home Help Search Login Register

+  World Families Forums
|-+  General Forums - Note: You must Be Logged In to post. Anyone can browse.
| |-+  Y-Haplogroups
| | |-+  The ancientness of R1a1a (M17)
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: The ancientness of R1a1a (M17)  (Read 2848 times)
Maliclavelli
Guru
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2146


« on: March 01, 2012, 11:30:55 AM »

An interesting haplotype of R1a1a (M17) has been found in the paper of Gunjan Sharma et al., Genetic Affinities of the Central Indian Tribal Population, PLoS one,  February 2012:
DYS19=18
DYS385=14-17
DYS389=15-30
DYS390=28
DYS391=12
DYS392=14
DYS393=13
DYS437=17
DYS439=13
DYS448=22
DYS456=17
DYS458=17

At first sight it could seem we have found the R-M420 not found so far in India with its DYS492=14, which presupposes a 13, whereas all the other R1a1a haplotypes have 11 or 10 and 12 from 11, but this haplotype has been tested for M17, then it isn’t an R-M420. Also the extremely large variance of the other markers makes us think that this value 14 derives from a modal 11 (or what was the modal at the origin of this subclade). Then again all the discourses about “modal” and “variance”, as I have supported many times, are worth nothing.
But I think it would be something to say about the TMRCA of 10.97+/-1.86 kya (25 y for generation) even though calculated by the Zhivotovsky rate. It is clear that these R1a1a-s belong to different clades and the massive presence of the clade most usually found falsifies the calculation. It is clear that this haplotype is an outlier, but for this more interesting, because testifies all the mutation gone mostly for the tangent and not around the modal. If we calculate the intraclade between two of these haplotypes, for instance with this closer to the modal: 15, 11-14, 14-32, 24,10, 11, 12,14,10, 20, 15,16 we have 32 mutations. Also using the usual mutation rate of 0,0022, we have:
(454x32)/28=518
518x25=12,950
and I have used a generation of 25 years and not 32 as I use usually, and I haven’t considered  other mutations around the modal.

Conclusions? The ancientness of the haplogroups is much much more than it is usually thought.
Logged

Maliclavelli


YDNA: R-S12460


MtDNA: K1a1b1e

Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


SEO light theme by © Mustang forums. Powered by SMF 1.1.13 | SMF © 2006-2011, Simple Machines LLC

Page created in 0.072 seconds with 17 queries.